Ferrari CEO Quits In A Huff, Says Company Is Now 'American'
09-11-14, 12:41 PM
#31
What you say applies to regular and some luxury cars not to the very high end.
Picture this: I walk in to my neighborhood jewelry store and buy a Patek & Phillipe watch for 20k. A few months later Patek & Phillipe comes out with a cheap watch for 3k. Now the brand is diluted, most people won't know the difference however I will. Now I'm upset, I spent 20k for the name on my wrist now this brand is considered attainable . Does that make my watch any worse? No. But does that change my perception of the brand? Yes. Will I be buying another? Probably not.
The same scenario can apply to Ferrari.
Picture this: I walk in to my neighborhood jewelry store and buy a Patek & Phillipe watch for 20k. A few months later Patek & Phillipe comes out with a cheap watch for 3k. Now the brand is diluted, most people won't know the difference however I will. Now I'm upset, I spent 20k for the name on my wrist now this brand is considered attainable . Does that make my watch any worse? No. But does that change my perception of the brand? Yes. Will I be buying another? Probably not.
The same scenario can apply to Ferrari.
Infra, very interesting point and i totally respect that, although i am not sure about fully buying into it, a lot to do with what doge says.
big part why i said unless we are true owners and buyers in that segment, it's really hard for any of us to say one way or another. what makes sense to us now with what w have now can rapid change once what we have is drastically changed.
i remember one thing very vividly by my director, who is a very humble man but at the same time well into 8 figures when company went ipo. he said "you look at things one way now, but when you are millionaire, the same won't make sense anymore. when you are 100millionaire, things change again. and when you are a billionaire like our founder, it changes completely again. it doesn't mean you spend more or you become a very flashy person, but your definition of value and prefer will shift"
big part why i said unless we are true owners and buyers in that segment, it's really hard for any of us to say one way or another. what makes sense to us now with what w have now can rapid change once what we have is drastically changed.
i remember one thing very vividly by my director, who is a very humble man but at the same time well into 8 figures when company went ipo. he said "you look at things one way now, but when you are millionaire, the same won't make sense anymore. when you are 100millionaire, things change again. and when you are a billionaire like our founder, it changes completely again. it doesn't mean you spend more or you become a very flashy person, but your definition of value and prefer will shift"
My point is that exclusivity is derived from the value associated with the brand, colloquially using value as the idea that the car is worth the high price charge for it. An increase in production cap by no means decreases this value if the cost of the car doesn't change! If more can be sold at the same price, common sense and some simple arithmetic indicates the brand is worth more.
So anyways, doge I don't disagree with you, but I think your point is not relevant to what I was saying.
rominl, what you say may be true, but we're not talking about individuals so much as we're talking about the demographic a business is selling to. The question is whether an increase in supply will lower prices. This would only occur if demand is being met. With waiting lists of years in some cases, demand is obviously quite high. So there's a lot of room to go before demand is even close to be satiated.
09-11-14, 01:28 PM
#32
Let's please be clear, that I don't think anyone is saying Ferrari is going to make a $100k car. I completely agree that would degrade the brand, for the simple reason that a $100k Ferrari in no way could have the same essence shared among the DNA of their other cars. It wouldn't feel like what we've come to know as a "Ferrari".
My point is that exclusivity is derived from the value associated with the brand, colloquially using value as the idea that the car is worth the high price charge for it. An increase in production cap by no means decreases this value if the cost of the car doesn't change! If more can be sold at the same price, common sense and some simple arithmetic indicates the brand is worth more.
So anyways, doge I don't disagree with you, but I think your point is not relevant to what I was saying.
rominl, what you say may be true, but we're not talking about individuals so much as we're talking about the demographic a business is selling to. The question is whether an increase in supply will lower prices. This would only occur if demand is being met. With waiting lists of years in some cases, demand is obviously quite high. So there's a lot of room to go before demand is even close to be satiated.
My point is that exclusivity is derived from the value associated with the brand, colloquially using value as the idea that the car is worth the high price charge for it. An increase in production cap by no means decreases this value if the cost of the car doesn't change! If more can be sold at the same price, common sense and some simple arithmetic indicates the brand is worth more.
So anyways, doge I don't disagree with you, but I think your point is not relevant to what I was saying.
rominl, what you say may be true, but we're not talking about individuals so much as we're talking about the demographic a business is selling to. The question is whether an increase in supply will lower prices. This would only occur if demand is being met. With waiting lists of years in some cases, demand is obviously quite high. So there's a lot of room to go before demand is even close to be satiated.
but yeah, if today they decide to make more 458 speciale or f12 to meet demand, i think that's a good path
09-11-14, 01:35 PM
#33
Pole Position
It's something of a stretch to think that increasing sales from 7000 units to say 10,000 or even a few more would really dilute the brand. And it's even more of one to think that a brand selling just 7000 units, even at Ferrari's average retail price, is truly sustainable in the long term. As others have said, with the long waiting lists there's clearly room to increase production and still have demand outstrip supply.
09-11-14, 02:09 PM
#34
Fiat gives outgoing Ferrari chairman $35M severance package
Luca di Montezemolo may not have wanted to leave Ferrari this way, but don't feel too bad for the departing chairman, because he'll be hitting the ground with a golden parachute so big that he'll never have to work again.
According to the latest reports, Fiat will pay Montezemolo 26.95 million euros (nearly $35 million) in severance pay. A little more than half of that will be paid in a lump sum of 13.71 million euros ($17.7M, equivalent to five times his annual salary) on January 31, 2015, with the rest to be paid within the next 20 years.
The payment is contingent on Montezemolo not going to work for a competitor, so don't expect to see him replacing Stephan Winkelmann at Lamborghini or Wolfgang Dürheimer at Bugatti any time soon. At least not until March 2017. Of course with that much cash on hand, the 67-year-old marquis need never work again, but considering how busy he's used to keeping himself, we'd be surprised if he didn't pop up again somewhere.
Aside from his leadership of Ferrari, Montezemolo has also chaired the Fiat Group, the Formula One Teams Association, industry associations Confindustria and FIEG, a local university, a political think tank, an America's Cup sailboat racing team, the 1990 World Cup of soccer and a high-speed train network. Recent reports have linked him to ailing Italian airline Alitalia, whose leadership he could very well assume, while earlier reports suggested he could run for prime minister.
According to the latest reports, Fiat will pay Montezemolo 26.95 million euros (nearly $35 million) in severance pay. A little more than half of that will be paid in a lump sum of 13.71 million euros ($17.7M, equivalent to five times his annual salary) on January 31, 2015, with the rest to be paid within the next 20 years.
The payment is contingent on Montezemolo not going to work for a competitor, so don't expect to see him replacing Stephan Winkelmann at Lamborghini or Wolfgang Dürheimer at Bugatti any time soon. At least not until March 2017. Of course with that much cash on hand, the 67-year-old marquis need never work again, but considering how busy he's used to keeping himself, we'd be surprised if he didn't pop up again somewhere.
Aside from his leadership of Ferrari, Montezemolo has also chaired the Fiat Group, the Formula One Teams Association, industry associations Confindustria and FIEG, a local university, a political think tank, an America's Cup sailboat racing team, the 1990 World Cup of soccer and a high-speed train network. Recent reports have linked him to ailing Italian airline Alitalia, whose leadership he could very well assume, while earlier reports suggested he could run for prime minister.
09-11-14, 02:17 PM
#35
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09-12-14, 02:53 AM
#43
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Let us say Ferrari goes from 7.000 to 10.000, that is not a big difference for a company as Ferrari. You have to know these are driving in the same places, say Monte Carlo, where you usually see them, you won't notice if there are more or less.
If Ferrari technically builds a sports car with mid-front V6 engine, transaxle DCT, and does all the handling tuning, and then this car get an Alfa Romeo 6C badge, with exterior and interior designed by Alfa Romeo, will the Ferrari exclusivity be lost? No. Just Alfa Romeo will have better cars, what in turn will bring in more money, which can then be spend on R&D to make even better cars.
If Ferrari technically builds a sports car with mid-front V6 engine, transaxle DCT, and does all the handling tuning, and then this car get an Alfa Romeo 6C badge, with exterior and interior designed by Alfa Romeo, will the Ferrari exclusivity be lost? No. Just Alfa Romeo will have better cars, what in turn will bring in more money, which can then be spend on R&D to make even better cars.
Last edited by Levi68; 09-12-14 at 02:56 AM.
09-12-14, 03:37 PM
#45
