I did the unthinkable
02-27-14, 08:07 PM
#61
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Hello everyone!
I guess I can say I am both sad and happy at the same time with what I am about to tell you. I have been a Lexus lover ever since we bought the original RX for my wife back in 1998-99. Since that time we have purchased 2 more RX's (latest one being the RX450h back in 2010) for my wife and I bought my first LS in December 2003 (2004 model) and finally a 2008 LS460L which I still own. However, I will only have this car for about 2 more weeks. I never thought the day would come when I would consider anything other than another Lexus for my next car. But that day is here.
After doing a lot of research a couple months ago, I decided that the best car for me at this stage in my life would be the 2014 S550. The innovation, incredible high tech features for comfort and safety blew me away. This car basically drives itself. Having said this, I still would not have pulled the trigger if the price was not right. But with the $4,500 discount I got for the S550, It would have cost me about as much to get a fully loaded 2014 LS460L AWD. However, some of the features on the S550 are not available on the LS.
When I test drove the new S550, it was heavenly. As I stated above, it basically drives itself. The massaging front seats with hot stone are out of this world. Since, I take several very long drives during the course of a year, this feature will be very soothing for my back. In any case, the deed is done. I still like Lexus and my wife still drives the RX450h, but I feel that Lexus has not been as responsive to the new technology as has Mercedes in recent years.
If someone would have told me a year or two ago that I would be getting a Mercedes for my next car, I would have called him/her crazy. But I guess as Bob Dillon wrote many years ago, "The times, they are a changin'." My S550 should be ready to pick up in about 2 weeks.
Before I finish rambling on, I want to give a very special thanks to jmcraney (Jeff) here. He has been a godsend with that wind noise problem than many of us experienced on the LS. Jeff, you are a fantastic human being. I hope everything is going great with you and your family.
I guess I can say I am both sad and happy at the same time with what I am about to tell you. I have been a Lexus lover ever since we bought the original RX for my wife back in 1998-99. Since that time we have purchased 2 more RX's (latest one being the RX450h back in 2010) for my wife and I bought my first LS in December 2003 (2004 model) and finally a 2008 LS460L which I still own. However, I will only have this car for about 2 more weeks. I never thought the day would come when I would consider anything other than another Lexus for my next car. But that day is here.
After doing a lot of research a couple months ago, I decided that the best car for me at this stage in my life would be the 2014 S550. The innovation, incredible high tech features for comfort and safety blew me away. This car basically drives itself. Having said this, I still would not have pulled the trigger if the price was not right. But with the $4,500 discount I got for the S550, It would have cost me about as much to get a fully loaded 2014 LS460L AWD. However, some of the features on the S550 are not available on the LS.
When I test drove the new S550, it was heavenly. As I stated above, it basically drives itself. The massaging front seats with hot stone are out of this world. Since, I take several very long drives during the course of a year, this feature will be very soothing for my back. In any case, the deed is done. I still like Lexus and my wife still drives the RX450h, but I feel that Lexus has not been as responsive to the new technology as has Mercedes in recent years.
If someone would have told me a year or two ago that I would be getting a Mercedes for my next car, I would have called him/her crazy. But I guess as Bob Dillon wrote many years ago, "The times, they are a changin'." My S550 should be ready to pick up in about 2 weeks.
Before I finish rambling on, I want to give a very special thanks to jmcraney (Jeff) here. He has been a godsend with that wind noise problem than many of us experienced on the LS. Jeff, you are a fantastic human being. I hope everything is going great with you and your family.
The issues with the BMW were:
- Lack of a spare after I ditched the run-flats
- Issues with fuel injection
But nothing matches the ride quality of a 7 series. The S class is more floaty, but the 2014 is in a class by itself.
Lexus has a lot of catching up to do in the performance department. In fact I like driving my son's RAV4 more than my LS!
02-28-14, 08:29 AM
#64
When I recently saw a post by “PatsSoxfan” I first thought that someone had added onto an old thread, but on closer examination I realized it was PSf himself. For those who don’t know PSf, he was an active poster three or four years ago and shared lots of wisdom about his experiences with his 2008 LS460L. PSf was instrumental, along with several others, in exposing the cause of the “Wind Noise” problem that plagued many of the ’07, ’08, and ’09 cars LS cars and some of the later models too. For those of you who are not familiar with those days, Lexus was trying all sorts of things to head off the dissension caused the wind noise reports. Lexus was replacing door and window gaskets on many cars, changing outside mirrors on a lot of cars, replacing front door glass on all the ’07 LS460s, adding an ugly deflector to the sides of the windshield on lots of cars, plugging drain holes in the outside mirrors and holes under the car, and most of these repairs didn’t yield any unequivocal improvement to the wind noise and Lexus was forced to buyback a large number of cars. The owners who had a wind noise problem were in open hostilities in this forum with owners who did not have a wind noise problem – those with quiet cars thought it was a subjectivity problem or imaginary. PSf helped mediate between the two sides and keep the discussion alive until we were able to demonstrate that most of the wind noise problems were related to a trim defect on the front doors that could be easily repaired. Lexus, much to their discredit, decided to declare that all of the cars “met specifications” and has never provided any relief to the owners who still have that problem and there are many cars that are still in need of repair. I don’t think most people would ever know what was causing the wind noise problem with out this forum.
I too am beginning to look for a replacement for my 2007 LS460. It has less than 50K and is in excellent condition, no problems except for the wind noise that was repaired six years ago and has remained stable since. But, like many today, we start chasing the technology rainbow so I am giving some thought to moving on.
I had not looked at the S 550 until PSf’s post. Wow! Lots of great technology. The thing that caught my eye was the dual displays. That is really a cool looking dash, much like the “glass cockpit” that emerged in aviation about 20 years ago. It is really different from the Lexus dash and I think you will see Lexus go that way very soon. That sort of thing gives those who are technology-averse the ******* but in my view it would enhance the reliability and reduce the cost of manufacturing and repair.
Charlie, with all that new technology, I am sure you are going to need some help with your new car and will be able to help other new owners, so I hope that you are able to hookup with another forum like the Club Lexus LS Group. I would never have enjoyed my car as much without this group and the help that you and others have provided. Thanks for helping us.
I too am beginning to look for a replacement for my 2007 LS460. It has less than 50K and is in excellent condition, no problems except for the wind noise that was repaired six years ago and has remained stable since. But, like many today, we start chasing the technology rainbow so I am giving some thought to moving on.
I had not looked at the S 550 until PSf’s post. Wow! Lots of great technology. The thing that caught my eye was the dual displays. That is really a cool looking dash, much like the “glass cockpit” that emerged in aviation about 20 years ago. It is really different from the Lexus dash and I think you will see Lexus go that way very soon. That sort of thing gives those who are technology-averse the ******* but in my view it would enhance the reliability and reduce the cost of manufacturing and repair.
Charlie, with all that new technology, I am sure you are going to need some help with your new car and will be able to help other new owners, so I hope that you are able to hookup with another forum like the Club Lexus LS Group. I would never have enjoyed my car as much without this group and the help that you and others have provided. Thanks for helping us.
Last edited by jmcraney; 03-02-14 at 09:12 AM.
02-28-14, 11:23 AM
#65
Lead Lap
Thread Starter
Jeff,
I'm repeating myself here but you give too much credit to others. You are the one that should take all the credit for helping SO many people with your expertise, intelligence and kindheartedness.
I will definitely post updates after I get the new S550 on this forum and let everyone know what I think about it. Without owning the car yet, but doing a lot of reading and research, I will be more than shocked if I will not be delighted with it. It sounds like you might join me in having fun with a new S550 purchase yourself. Please keep in touch.
I'm repeating myself here but you give too much credit to others. You are the one that should take all the credit for helping SO many people with your expertise, intelligence and kindheartedness.
I will definitely post updates after I get the new S550 on this forum and let everyone know what I think about it. Without owning the car yet, but doing a lot of reading and research, I will be more than shocked if I will not be delighted with it. It sounds like you might join me in having fun with a new S550 purchase yourself. Please keep in touch.
02-28-14, 11:58 AM
#67
Lexus Test Driver
Agreed! What jmcraney has done for all of us as LS460 owners and the industry can not be praised enough! Jeff will be greatly missed if/when he too moves to purchase the S550.
In fact reading in the most recent Consumer Reports there was an article discussing the LS460's reliability and it mentioned the wind noise issue in the earlier models which made me immediately think of the "jmcraney fix"
In fact reading in the most recent Consumer Reports there was an article discussing the LS460's reliability and it mentioned the wind noise issue in the earlier models which made me immediately think of the "jmcraney fix"
03-02-14, 07:44 AM
#69
Lexus Fanatic
03-02-14, 08:22 PM
#70
Lexus Test Driver
Lexus "performance" (or lack there of) is why I'm trading in both my 2013 RX350 and 2012 LS460L in July and moving on. I don't want a small car like an IS-F or RC-F. A GS-F or an LS with competitive power would have kept me onboard. But Lexus has lost me. Who has the wool pulled over you guy's eyes?
03-02-14, 08:53 PM
#72
Lexus Fanatic
This is my question...when did Lexus become a "performance" car? They're branching out some with the LFA. IS-F, F Sport models and it looks like performance is coming with the RC-F, GS-F. But...if someone bough an LS460 expecting it to be some screaming performance car they just absolutely bought the wrong car. IMHO the statement that one would trade their LS460 L (not even the SWB LS460, the fricking huge "L" model) because its not a "performance car" absurd. Never should have bought the thing in the first place. And an RX350? Being a FWD Camry based crossover its the antithesis of any performance aspirations. Why did you choose these cars Sal?
Personally, I don't have an issue with owners who want "performance" moving on to other brands. I'd rather see that then them make the LS into something it shouldn't try to be and wind up ruining it in the process. Have the performance models sure, have a GS-F, LS-F, IS-, RC-F...but you still need to have the LS be what it should be at its core, which is a tomb quiet highway cruiser. Even my GS, thats what I love about it...its a great handling car when you want it to be but its a great smooth and quiet around town/highway car when you want it to be that too.
I mean...the LS is no slouch. 386 hp 367 lb/ft of torque as base power. I mean...thats best in class. 7 Series starts with the I6 at 315HP/332ft/lbs. Sure it comes with a much more powerful V8 option...but it starts $20k more. A6 comes with a V6 332HP/325 ft/lbs....$16,000 more. Jag's the same....MB is the same.
Seeing that the vast majority of these cars are sold with base power...most LS owners are driving more powerful cars than the competition. I find the idea that the last manufacturer to offer standard V8 power in their flagship offers "laughable performance" ridiculous.
Personally, I don't have an issue with owners who want "performance" moving on to other brands. I'd rather see that then them make the LS into something it shouldn't try to be and wind up ruining it in the process. Have the performance models sure, have a GS-F, LS-F, IS-, RC-F...but you still need to have the LS be what it should be at its core, which is a tomb quiet highway cruiser. Even my GS, thats what I love about it...its a great handling car when you want it to be but its a great smooth and quiet around town/highway car when you want it to be that too.
I mean...the LS is no slouch. 386 hp 367 lb/ft of torque as base power. I mean...thats best in class. 7 Series starts with the I6 at 315HP/332ft/lbs. Sure it comes with a much more powerful V8 option...but it starts $20k more. A6 comes with a V6 332HP/325 ft/lbs....$16,000 more. Jag's the same....MB is the same.
Seeing that the vast majority of these cars are sold with base power...most LS owners are driving more powerful cars than the competition. I find the idea that the last manufacturer to offer standard V8 power in their flagship offers "laughable performance" ridiculous.
Last edited by SW17LS; 03-02-14 at 09:10 PM.
03-02-14, 09:10 PM
#73
Lexus Test Driver
This is my question...when did Lexus become a "performance" car? They're branching out some with the LFA. IS-F, F Sport models and it looks like performance is coming with the RC-F, GS-F. But...if someone bough an LS460 expecting it to be some screaming performance car they just absolutely bought the wrong car. IMHO the statement that one would trade their LS460 L (not even the SWB LS460, the fricking huge "L" model) because its not a "performance car" absurd. Never should have bought the thing in the first place. And an RX350? Being a FWD Camry based crossover its the antithesis of any performance aspirations. Why did you choose these cars Sal?
Personally, I don't have an issue with owners who want "performance" moving on to other brands. I'd rather see that then them make the LS into something it shouldn't try to be and wind up ruining it in the process. Have the performance models sure, have a GS-F, LS-F, IS-, RC-F...but you still need to have the LS be what it should be at its core, which is a tomb quiet highway cruiser. Even my GS, thats what I love about it...its a great handling car when you want it to be but its a great smooth and quiet around town/highway car when you want it to be that too.
Personally, I don't have an issue with owners who want "performance" moving on to other brands. I'd rather see that then them make the LS into something it shouldn't try to be and wind up ruining it in the process. Have the performance models sure, have a GS-F, LS-F, IS-, RC-F...but you still need to have the LS be what it should be at its core, which is a tomb quiet highway cruiser. Even my GS, thats what I love about it...its a great handling car when you want it to be but its a great smooth and quiet around town/highway car when you want it to be that too.
The RX350 is being replaced by an X5.
03-02-14, 09:16 PM
#74
Lexus Fanatic
I don't need the LS to be a screamer. I just need it to be competitive. It's by far the worst performing full-size premium rear wheel drive luxury sedan. I never said I expected it to be an M3 or M5. But the S550, 750Li, S8 and basically everything else in this class outperforms the LS by leaps and bounds. Same goes for the midsize class vehicles...
Its the same way in the midsize segment, I drove everything in that segment before I bought the GS...and IMHO (and the opinion of the automotive press) the GS was the best driving car in the segment. Now, can it compare power wise to a 550 or E550 or S6? No...but its not supposed to.
Thats the argument for a GS-F...its coming.
The RX350 is being replaced by an X5.
03-02-14, 09:20 PM
#75
Lexus Test Driver
The thing is - Lexus does not give me the option to purchase what I want. There are many thousands of people like me. Options are important. This is why I left Cadillac years ago. I realize that "for the price", the LS is hard to beat. But I'm more concerned about driving a car that performs well than costs less - so I'm moving on.
I think it would be prudent for Lexus to offer options for people like myself. The GS-F would satisfy my craving for a premium luxury car with power - if it were here...
Lexus dropped the V8 in the GS for this generation. That car should have had a v8 that outperformed the previous generation. Lexus is moving in the wrong direction for me.
The "new" LS has the same lazy drivetrain as the previous generation. I really don't know what to think here... No progress. No forward thinking. I see a lot of "resting on laurels" the way Cadillac did years ago. Not good. And NOT what I expect from a top-tier luxury automobile company.
I think it would be prudent for Lexus to offer options for people like myself. The GS-F would satisfy my craving for a premium luxury car with power - if it were here...
Lexus dropped the V8 in the GS for this generation. That car should have had a v8 that outperformed the previous generation. Lexus is moving in the wrong direction for me.
The "new" LS has the same lazy drivetrain as the previous generation. I really don't know what to think here... No progress. No forward thinking. I see a lot of "resting on laurels" the way Cadillac did years ago. Not good. And NOT what I expect from a top-tier luxury automobile company.
Last edited by Sal Collaziano; 03-02-14 at 09:24 PM.