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Old 01-03-14, 09:49 AM   #1
yowps3
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Default How is Lexus doing?

How is Lexus doing so far with their new 'sports' theme?

Should they go back to their old theme?
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Old 01-03-14, 09:54 AM   #2
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To my surprise it was more refined and quieter than my IS350.
The A7 costs at least 2x as much as your IS350...it should definitely be more refined and quieter.

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POWER- For a brand that is 'supposedly' going after raw performance their paper power numbers and also MPG are way behind the big 3 Germans.
I agree. Lexus is sorely behind here, and I think they know it. Word is that an entirely new generation of powertrains is around the corner, but they cannot come soon enough.

As for the rest of your post, I think that Lexus is just not the best brand for you anymore. Lots of people are very happy, sales numbers are higher, the brand is expanding globally and we've never had as many high performance products as we have now, and that portfolio keeps expanding. All in all, Lexus seems to be in a better place than it's ever been, but at the same time, the market and competitive forces are changing - economic developments and the Germans going into the sub-$30k market are two of the biggest changes.
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Old 01-03-14, 09:59 AM   #3
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I like the direction Lexus is going. The new design is aggressive I wish they would've kept just for the GS and IS.
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Old 01-03-14, 10:09 AM   #4
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I agreed with everyone so far. Lexus has been lacking behind in Power. Yet, on the same time Germain are pushing Sub 30k Luxury vehicles.

That is nothing just yet, they are pushing Sub 30k with around 300 HP.

Now that is what so crazy about it.

The only thing Lexus is doing right nowadays are

1/ Customer Services
2/ Reliability

Pricing, the A7 is way too high, it can not be compared to the IS-350. But the A3 will kick the IS line up badly. How about reliability issues ?

I recently figured that if a person buy a Brand new car, the Depreciation of the car after 4 years is 50%, and worse afterward. So people who love Brand new car is 80% more likely to Trade in for another Brand new car, where 4 years warranty is up, and you never had to pay a dime
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Old 01-03-14, 10:57 AM   #5
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Lexus is still one the prestige luxury brand in the US behind maybe Mercedes
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Old 01-03-14, 11:42 AM   #6
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Lexus cant be everything for everyone... they are not trying to please everyone anymore, so people who dont like current and upcoming lineup, can look elsewhere.

I had both 2007 GS and 2009 IS. They were good cars but 2013 GS and 2014 IS are league above them in quality, style and performance.

p.s. 2013 has been a best year for Lexus in the history and 2014 can go only further.
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Old 01-03-14, 11:49 AM   #7
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Lexus cant be everything for everyone... they are not trying to please everyone anymore, so people who dont like current and upcoming lineup, can look elsewhere.

I had both 2007 GS and 2009 IS. They were good cars but 2013 GS and 2014 IS are league above them in quality, style and performance.

p.s. 2013 has been a best year for Lexus in the history and 2014 can go only further.
I agree with you 100% the new GS and IS are leagues above the last gen I hope Lexus update the engine so the GS could have at least 350-370 HP
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Old 01-03-14, 12:50 PM   #8
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Lexus sold a record amount of cars in 2013. They continue to lead in quality. Their technology continues to improve and their product continues to expand. F-sport has expanded. Lexus enthusiasts continue to grow. Their reputation continues to grow worldwide. Their dealerships continue to improve with upscale facilities.

Lexus is also one of the most valuable brands in the world even though its only 25 years young.

Like any business, they have opportunities. TO say "where did they go so wrong' is actually a "so wrong" conclusion. And Lexus reads these things and that is partly why they stay away…..

I hope to have some stuff to share from Japan next week or so….
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Old 01-03-14, 02:28 PM   #9
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Lexus sold a record amount of cars in 2013. They continue to lead in quality. Their technology continues to improve and their product continues to expand. F-sport has expanded. Lexus enthusiasts continue to grow. Their reputation continues to grow worldwide. Their dealerships continue to improve with upscale facilities.

Lexus is also one of the most valuable brands in the world even though its only 25 years young.

Like any business, they have opportunities. TO say "where did they go so wrong' is actually a "so wrong" conclusion. And Lexus reads these things and that is partly why they stay awayÖ..

I hope to have some stuff to share from Japan next week or soÖ.
Damn Mike, you on a roll! When you become the new President of Lexus Corp - I want a free LFA.
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Old 01-03-14, 03:05 PM   #10
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I think the OP's beef has mostly to do with the new Lexus design direction/language as opposed to the company identity. (basically hates the grill design)

Lexus isn't the only auto company that has undertaken a marketing shift. They all do it in an effort to move more product, obviously to varying degrees of success. True, 10 years ago, Lexus would probably have laughed at the thought of actually plumbing engine roar into the cabin (GS) since cabin isolation was #1 on its list. But neither would BMW have put the cushy suspension from the current 5 series into the widely acclaimed E39 two generations ago.

Also, considering that Lexus (the actual brand) only launched in the early 90s, it's still the new kid on the block and has more acceptable freedom, in my opinion, to redefine its identity.
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Old 01-03-14, 03:24 PM   #11
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Very simple where Lexus went wrong - they made a bet on HYBRIDS being the future and they were wrong!

No one can question the sales success of the Prius and some of the great Hybrid technology Toyota/Lexus pioneered.
Unfortunately this took a huge amount of R&D $$$ and took away from other areas of development.
All Lexus Hybrids never took off in terms of sales and the HS was discontinued completely in the US.

Good news is now Lexus is again spending R&D $$$$ for chassis development, interior/exterior design, and NEW GAS powertrains. The future looks promising especially if they dont mess up the F brand.
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Old 01-03-14, 03:45 PM   #12
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We all know back a few years ago and closer to the beginning of its launch Lexus had it all. They were leading all the packs. HP, design, luxury and cool factor etc
L-Finesse was a great design direction. Unfortunately with it came cost cutting never seen before in previous Lexusís. The 2006 GS300 and 2007 ES350 were prime offenders when it came to fit and finish, cabin materials and assembly. Compare to a 2005 GS300 or 2006 ES330 which while they werenít the prettiest in terms of design, their material quality and assembly were bar none when compared to the competition. Thankfully this was corrected or rather addressed in 2010 when some poor plastics were taken care of and of course when new models like the CT and 4GS came out a renewed level of quality came back to play. In terms of technology they were always in the thick of it. Even though some of the navigation systems were primitive to todayís naviís, they were ahead of the competiton.

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I ask this question because today I had a chance to drive the Audi A7 and what I noticed is that Lexus doesn't have anything like it in its lineup. The A7 packs incredible luxury, performance, comfort and a cool looking design all in one package.
I completely agree Lexus needs a four door coupe. Iíve petitioned for FS350, FS450h and FS-F

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To my surprise it was more refined and quieter than my IS350.
No surprise. The IS350 does not compete with the A7 which is more laden with tech and luxury. For what you pay Iíd hope itís quieter and more refined than our 2IS.

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What happened to Lexus? They were still ahead in 2007. But since about 2010 they've been in some identity crisis. Lexus doesn't seem to know what they want to do and to be honest lately they've been serving us some half baked products. Take the 3IS for example. While Lexus obviously shows that they're adding aggression into the formulae, the car lacks the finesse that the brand was known for and also the finesse the Germans all have, especially Audi. Which IMO will become the top luxury auto brand of the world.
The sales success of the 2004-2009 RX and 2007+ ES, as well L-Finesse, more hybrids, DI 3.5 V6, LS600hL and 8-Speed auto helped push Lexus to the front. However 2010 was a dark age as mammoth recalls and the tsunami affected Lexusís sales crown. L-Finesse quality (not design) caught up and bit them in the ****. Still you have to give credit that 4 years later Lexus is standing tall. That said the limited options (like choice of powertrains), packaging by region, little customization compared to the competition donít do any justice for a Luxury badged automaker. While I do believe its important to add Sport into the mix as this is what society apparently wants now, I also believe its important to remember your core values and beginnings of what made your company so successful. I have no problem with aggressive, but Lexus needs to do it in a way that you still feel the Luxury aspect. VW and Audi may have a world domination mentality aimed at 2018 but Audi has a long way to go to catch Mercedes-Benz which is the undisputed king of both sales and Luxury at the moment.

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Next you have the RC concept coupe?? Lexus has not made it clear what their intentions are with that car. They showed us the sleek RC Coupe but later said that was only a concept. Then they teased what seems to be the RC-F. But the problem with that is that if the RC-F looks anything like what we've seen so far than Lexus has truly lost it. I mean why do they have to be at the extreme polarity? Can't you have performance, luxury, comfort, beauty and refinement in ONE piece? The blue RC-F that we've all seen by now surely must be a faux. If it's the actual product than Lexus has truly lost the plot.
Iíll agree to the effect that currently Lexus is making you choose Sport OR LuxuryÖ no.. I want both. I want a vehicle that is elegant and refined yet can turn bonkers at a momentís notice.

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So let me get it straight Lexus was making cars which had their OWN NICHE in the market and one day they woke up and said WE SHOULD BECOME A PERFORMANCE BRAND! SO LETS START BY MAKING ALL OUR CARS WITH A HIDEOUS GRILL , THEN WE WILL DESIGN ALL OUR CARS WITH COARSE LINES THAT DO NOT FLOW AND TO TOP IT OFF WE WILL GIVE OUR CARS SHARP BENDS AND CREASES TO ENHANCE THE UGLYNESS AND WE WILL ALSO HAVE GAPS AND EXTRA CREASES EVERYWHERE BECAUSE NOW WE ARE A HIGH PERFORMANCE BRAND!!
This is subjective so I wonít argue this. I happen to like certain Spindles but not others. I like the LS, RX and IS, but the half-arsed spindle on the GS (canít wait till the full spindle refresh) and the one on the ES I canít stand but thatís in part because of the gap between spindle and hood.

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POWER- For a brand that is 'supposedly' going after raw performance their paper power numbers and also MPG are way behind the big 3 Germans.
There is a forced induction future for Lexus soon. The TTV6 and TTV8 are supposed to have better power and efficiency than the competition. Letís hope

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The new Spindle-Grill Lexus interiors are a nightmare no doubt, I won't bother talking about them. I'll give you hints; cheap, black, plastic, cheap, cheap, cheap... Which is quite ironic because Lexus used to be renowned for their top quality and excellent craftsmanship of their interior.
With the exception of the GS anything below it.. well most know my opinion on some of the latest plastics..

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So what is going on at this brand exactly? Please if anyone is listening BRING BACK THE PEOPLE WHO WERE IN CHARGE OF LEXUS DURING THE L-FINESSE DAYS get rid of the mess that this new direction has created.
N/A

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The only thing going for them right now is the RX. Take that away and the brand will fall. I'm afraid if Lexus does not clean their act they will end up in the doldrums with Infiniti & Acura. They'll get passed by Audi & Cadillac in the all too important USA market.
RX is obviously a great seller, but it lacks many Luxury features in the States like panoramic sunroof, adjustable lift gate, rear seat climate controls that the competiton or even whats available on a fully loaded Nissan Pathfinder. The RX is a nice vehicle but is not as prestigious as it should be. BMW, MBZ and Audi have their own thing going on, Lexus, Cadillac and Jaguar are actually coming on with some intensity and Infiniti, Acura and Lincoln continue to search for an identity.
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Old 01-03-14, 03:51 PM   #13
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Very simple where Lexus went wrong - they made a bet on HYBRIDS being the future and they were wrong!

No one can question the sales success of the Prius and some of the great Hybrid technology Toyota/Lexus pioneered.
Unfortunately this took a huge amount of R&D $$$ and took away from other areas of development.
All Lexus Hybrids never took off in terms of sales and the HS was discontinued completely in the US.

Good news is now Lexus is again spending R&D $$$$ for chassis development, interior/exterior design, and NEW GAS powertrains. The future looks promising especially if they dont mess up the F brand.
This conclusion makes no sense since Lexus sells more hybrids than all other luxury brands combined and all the other luxury brands rushed to make hybrids. The HS sold poor here but is a hit in Japan. Now we have Ferrari, Mclaren and Porsche hybrids.
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Old 01-03-14, 04:29 PM   #14
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Where did Lexus go so wrong?
Although it is a rather complex question, and an entire book can be written about it, there are two relatively simple answers. One, Lexus forgot who they were and what made them successful (primarily a builder of non-sport-oriented luxury cars) and tried to become a Japanese BMW. Two, the bean-counters in the organization got too much power, and we saw a decline in the quality of the materials used in many of the newer Lexus products. What the company needs to do is to return to its roots.
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Old 01-03-14, 04:36 PM   #15
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IMO the thread title is misleading. It makes it sound like the division is going out of business.
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