Toyota Turbo plans revealed at Tokyo
11-24-13, 01:13 PM
#31
Lexus Champion
In August CR magazine recapped the percentage of cars that missed their EPA estimates by more than 10% in their Road Tests.
55% of Hybrids
28% Small turbos
10% of Conventional cars
Interesting numbers.
55% of Hybrids
28% Small turbos
10% of Conventional cars
Interesting numbers.
11-24-13, 03:12 PM
#33
Lexus Champion
Probably no surprise but the widest differences appear to be some Ford hybrid products. The Lincoln MKZ hybrid missed its EPA estimate by 11 mpg and the C-Max hybrid by 10 mpg.
11-24-13, 03:18 PM
#34
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11-24-13, 03:23 PM
#35
toyota's doing what they need to do to become competitive and sounds like their plans are innovative and excellent. however, i'm not excited about the industry trend in general. i think it's really sad the whole car industry is being forced to offer tiny engines with turbos...
only the very few will ever know what a v8 is like in the future.
only the very few will ever know what a v8 is like in the future.
Puhlease, we have twin turbo V8's now. The car industry offers far more choices than ever, and jusr about every car is good now... even Haiyondies and Chryslers are not total junk anymore. Hell, even the new Lada Kalina is pretty darn good.
11-24-13, 07:30 PM
#36
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11-24-13, 08:04 PM
#37
There are far more 550's on the road and V8 power X5s, X6, GLs and so on than ever before. And 70k todays money isn't what it was in the 90ies either. Cars in the last five years have improved tremendously, everyone made giant leaps. Auto industry is also posting record sales numbers month after month. Todays cars with modern drivetrains drive better than ever before. Maintaining and repairing them in the long run is going to be expensive - but thats a whole another story.
11-24-13, 09:36 PM
#38
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Yes, they announced that it will have D4S. Together with new VVTi,
Australian media write that Lexus head in PR conference that 2.0l was designed to have power of 3.5l V6 and "up to" 350nm.
Not sure what it means, they estimate 300hp and 350nm, but I dont think thats going to happen in NX... Maybe in some other model or maybe they will have several power outputs.
http://www.caradvice.com.au/260570/l...petrol-engine/
Australian media write that Lexus head in PR conference that 2.0l was designed to have power of 3.5l V6 and "up to" 350nm.
Not sure what it means, they estimate 300hp and 350nm, but I dont think thats going to happen in NX... Maybe in some other model or maybe they will have several power outputs.
http://www.caradvice.com.au/260570/l...petrol-engine/
11-25-13, 03:59 AM
#39
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
i think these days anyone can do 300hp turbo... question is what kind of longevity and real life power and fuel numbers.
11-25-13, 08:40 AM
#40
yes i meant a turbo exhaust manifold. being that it's used in racing, it was only a matter of time before a production car used this design. im surprised that toyota looks to be the first. its a big step imo because they didnt just come out with a run of the mill DI turbo 4. instead they went and tried to improve upon it. instead of just DI perhaps they will use D4S? can they even add valvematic? combine this with the exhaust manifold cylinder head and i can see this engine being a winner...
1.) DI + turbo isnt new anymore. its basically the standard. even cheap kias have DI turbos. that's why this new turbo engine may be special. they went above and beyond simply slapping a turbo on a DI engine.
2.) small turbos run out of breath in the upper rpm range. the article specifically says that toyota wanted to decrease lag by using the exhaust manifold cylinder heads so that they can run larger turbos.
1.) DI + turbo isnt new anymore. its basically the standard. even cheap kias have DI turbos. that's why this new turbo engine may be special. they went above and beyond simply slapping a turbo on a DI engine.
2.) small turbos run out of breath in the upper rpm range. the article specifically says that toyota wanted to decrease lag by using the exhaust manifold cylinder heads so that they can run larger turbos.
The integrated of exhaust manifold with cylinder head decreases the volume of exhaust gasses between the cylinders and the turbine, as well as reducing the under-hood temperatures by eliminating hot steel tubing to connect the two. Because hot gasses are typically highly compressible, part of the infamous turbo "lag" can be eliminated by reducing the length of pipe.
The other considerable factor in lag is turbine spin-up time. This is mostly eliminated by the twin scroll turbo and the grouping of cylinders to even out the pressure pulses hitting the turbine.
It will remain to be seen if the lag is really gone or not. Most likely it will still be there, but I'm guessing only perceptible under full-throttle scenarios. It will certainly have less lag than BMW's N54 or N55, though.
11-25-13, 09:55 AM
#41
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hopefully the toyota turbo 4 can use the cylinder head exhaust manifold to get similar low rpm performance, yet run a larger turbo for more up top.
yes i believe it took them some time to fit both the DI injectors and valvetronic in the head. hopefully toyota thought ahead and this "new VVTi" on the turbo 4 is in fact valvematic. if that's the case, then the toyota turbo 4 will have D4-S, valvematic, and the twin scroll cylinder head exhaust manifold. it would be the best turbo 4, period.
Last edited by madfast; 11-25-13 at 10:00 AM.
11-25-13, 12:27 PM
#43
It may not be Valvematic™, but if not, likely something we havn't seen before.
11-25-13, 01:22 PM
#45
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
If one wants to eliminate turbo-lag, the best way is to smooth out the pressure pulses hitting the turbine. The twin scroll design and cylinder grouping does that somewhat, but controlling the exhaust valve timing & lift is also part of that.
It may not be Valvematic™, but if not, likely something we havn't seen before.
It may not be Valvematic™, but if not, likely something we havn't seen before.