Lexuslvr91

"The 2013 Lexus GS F Sport has taken down the likes of the BMW 535i, Audi A6 and Infiniti M37 in previous comparisons, and is our reigning king of the luxury performance sedan segment. The new 2014 Cadillac CTS Vsport brings two turbos, over 100 more horsepower, and a history of excellent track-day capability to the table, but weighs over 100 lbs. more than the Lexus. Can the light, balanced, and nimble Lexus hold its own against the American powerhouse Cadillac CTS V Sport? On this episode of Head 2 Head, Jonny Lieberman takes both cars to the testing grounds, canyon roads, and finally the racetrack to find out."

http://m.motortrend.com/multimedia/v...5/a9faBE_ceJY/

baddis es

iTrader: (3)

pretty good comparo...Lexus really needs to up these FSport models with power rather than just suspension and other driving dynamics. With a 350-375hp FSport, I think the comparo would have been reversed and Lexus would trump the VSport but at a 100+ hp difference...it was losing from the beginning.

GS350 - 306hp
GS FSport - 350-375hp
GS F - 465+

We could only hope Lexus listens :/

TangoRed

To the F-sport's defense, it's pricing is more in line with the CTS 3.6. I agree they should move the F-sport up a notch in pricing and power though. The CTS is taking all the fire out of Lexus' recent gains with the GS.

baddis es

iTrader: (3)

havent checked out the VSport pricing but from the video, they note the VSport being 60k and the FSport being 59k

MPLexus301

iTrader: (3)

Lexus needs to not take the standard 5-6 years (that they take to do everything) to get turbo motors to market. Yes, the 2GR-FSE is a great engine, but it's time for an update of some sort, be it a revision of the engine or the addition of turbos. That's all there is to it.

Looking forward to seeing what Lexus does to revise the 2015 GS.

CTS VSport is an extremely, extremely impressive vehicle and probably best in segment right now. Major thumbs up to Cadillac - this is what you get when you play to win. Take note, Lexus.

spwolf

i dont think there will be ever a 350hp V6 GS... there will be GS-F for people who want fast.

Lexus cant compete with everyone, as simple as that. They are last manufacturer that will have 5 engines to offer for GS.

And CTS Premium is $10k more expensive... base CTS with twin turbo V6 is $60k bs base GS being what, $48k?

There is a big difference in price as well.

I8ABMR

The cars in the comparison are 1k apart. They are equal. Lexus got served........ There is no excuse for this big of a deficiency in power . ZERO !!


No, Lexus cant compete with everyone, BUT they can compete with their competition. This is no contest. Lexus got worked. In 2007 Lexus bumped the GS power from 245 to 303 hp. Its time for another monumental jump. If we love Lexus we need to stop making excuses for them. Yes the GS is amazing, but it needs to be better yet. Handling is great but we want it all and they can give it to us. Bring it Lexus.

I think its time to start thinking of adding a diff for even better handling at the limit and please get rid of some of the fender gap like the rest of the competition

spwolf

lol, no - they picked base CTS with twin turbo vs F-Sport... equip CTS twin turbo with Premium package and it is $10k-12k more expensive than F-Sport.

Base doesnt have full leather seats for instance... for $59k.

I8ABMR

I see what you're saying buddy. Bottom line the GS is not even available in a trim to keep up with this caddy. The GS F sport is beneath the V sport caddy and the GSF will be above it and way more expensive.

I would trade leather for a better suspension, electric LSD, and 100+ HP to be honest. I think after some drive the caddy Lexus will lose some customers.

Also the car in the video looked like it had leather or some leatherette . Looked pretty damn good to me .LOL

Hoovey689

iTrader: (16)

This should End/ the Thread.

This is why I'm hoping that Lexus takes this Method that Audi and Cadillac are using with A4, S4, RS4 and Cadillac CTS, CTS VSport, CTS-V. Lexus needs to give F-Sport a kick in the pants. Make it a real sporting but tailored luxury sedan. The trend now is downsizing so this is perfect time to introduce a base turbo 4, V6, Twin Turbo V6 F-Sport and V8 GS-F. Make the line-up far more competitive and relevant. Hope its not wishful thinking

I8ABMR

I know the 60K CTS V sport doesnt have leather but in the video it looked like leather to me. I know it may be a cheaper leather but bottom line is there is no 60K car with cloth seats in this review.

The added 10k on the CTS only gets you real leather, added luxury features, and a panoramic roof. I am pretty sure what we saw in the video is the CTS that will sell better. Its got what you want and none of what you don't need. I usually hate domestic brands, but these guys are making better cars every year and this CTS is a HUGE step in the right direction. I know the GS was the reigning king but it will not be able to hold the crown for long with that motor. In the luxury segment drivers want it all. These sports sedans literally have to do it all. Lexus does most very well. The caddy does it all very well. The electric LSD from the vette is a huge deal. The 115hp deficiency is for the Lexus a bigger deal. All this makes the Caddy the better deal. LOL

I love Lexus and would probably buy the GS to be honest but if we love Lexus we need to stop blowing smoke up their asses and demand more . Bring it Lexus. We need a TTV6 with 375 HP NOW !! We need an intermediate power plant between the GSF and the GS. The carry over motor with 2 extra HP over last gen is shameful

MPLexus301

iTrader: (3)

Turbos, superchargers, naturally aspirated, V Sport, F Sport, real leather, pleather, etc...

It boils down to choice. The real definition of luxury - what it's really about - is choice.

Lexus does a nice job of packaging together what they think people want and will buy, but they still have a long way to go to cater to the consumer who is looking for a truly premium buying experience. This goes well beyond just the dealership experience - where Lexus already excels - and includes boundless options and allowing a buyer to customize a car to their own specs. We need more interior and exterior colors and combinations, more wheel choices and more engines. One gasoline engine and one hybrid just aren't enough to really compete with the others right now, when BMW offers everything from a 528i to an M5 and Cadillac lets you choose from an array of cylinders, displacement and horsepower options.

I think the GS is sadly caught in a catch-22 here: Lexus is hesitant to throw the type of resources and money that is needed to make the GS into a formidable/equal 5/E/A6/CTS competitor because the car has not been historically very successful in terms of sales. On the flip side, perhaps the car isn't successful because it isn't giving buyers the options and choices that they want when plunking down $50-$80k. So what will happen? Lexus will either keep doing just enough to keep the car relevant, and be happy with that; they'll wise up and give us a full-scale GS line with base engines, upscale engines, hybrids, F, F Sport, etc and more choices for options; OR they'll ultimately give up and let the ES rule as Lexus' midsize sedan.

We've already read reports that some within Lexus wanted to cancel this generation of GS but thankfully Akio Toyoda wouldn't let it happen. It's just frustrating to watch the car flounder or live up to be 7/10 of it's potential, generation after generation.

The GS could significantly differentiate itself from the ES just by offering more configurations, options, engines and trim levels. This needs to happen, badly.

I'm not picking on the GS - it's a great car. But it's a great car that competes against the E350 and 535i. There are segments above and below - CTS 2.0T/528i to M5/E63 where Lexus just isn't even playing - and Lexus needs to be there too. There's no question.

/End rant.

Hoovey689

iTrader: (16)

It all comes down to if Lexus wants to be considered truly on par with Mercedes and BMW, they have to fight fire with fire. Simply put you need to match ever Rook for Rook and Pawn for Pawn. The Luxury market is like a Chess Game, and hence equivelant pieces allow for more equal competition and comparison.

They get the Customer Service and Dealership Experience the best of the bunch, but in terms of stacking up against the competition and tailoring vehicles more to the Buyer they have work that needs to be done

lamar411

The thing is if they add power to the GS F-Sport, they have to do the same to the rest of the F-Sports (CT, IS, RX, LS) or else what does it mean? You can't have the same trim doing different things on different things. It is stupid if the GS F sport gets a power bump. but the IS F Sport stays just cosmetic and suspension. Ditto for the rest of the lineup.

Hoovey689

iTrader: (16)

Why the negative thought? Who's to say Lexus wouldn't do that to the rest of the lineup. Reason it wasn't mentioned was because this thread pertains to the GS. If Lexus did infact mirror competitors and make F-Sport a stepping stone between Base and Full Fledged Performance versions then of course they'd do that do the rest of the line-up