spwolf

yeah, our local gas prices went down by 1% today... LOL.
Thats how it works...

LexFather

Not true at all, we continue to get more powerful and more fuel efficient. There are now a handful of cars with 340-380hp getting 30 MPG average. That is progress. They need to continue.

And you haven't driven the GS 450h.

You haven't driven the GS 450h.

You haven't driven the GS 450h.

Joeb427

iTrader: (1)

and when a barrel goes up,the pumps do immediately.

spwolf

and for more than it went up :-)

I bet if we look at 2007 for what prices were at the pump when crude was $86 (or whenver), we would get 30% lesser price than today.

mmarshall

I don't see how that ties in with what I was saying, though. I was discussing the reasons that many people often give for actually buying hybrids.......not just test-driving them. And hybrids, of course, differ widely in their design and intended driving-styles....one reason why a GS450H is a long way from a Honda Insight or Toyota Prius C.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

doesn't matter, and not relevant. may be wonderful to some, and i'm sure i'd love driving it, but it ain't selling well for the reasons i gave.

Lil4X

Cars with potential horsepower don't produce big mileage numbers when they are driven at the limits of performance. If you're content to totter around all day, never putting all that potential to the ground, sure, you'll get mileage - but the weight penalty you pay for dragging the big motor around - not only related to engine weight but the weight of the entire monster powertrain and suspension required to put it all down will eat your gas card alive when you press hard on the loud pedal all day.

That's simple physics - it takes energy to produce thrust and overcome weight there's just no getting around that. Dragging around a massive battery pack is not the way to achieve that goal. Gasoline is still the champ for producing power per pound. As you consume that fuel, the vehicle gets even lighter. Batteries don't do that.

As an example, take the Lotus Elise S: It gets 37.5mpg on the combined urban/extra-urban cycle while thrashing out a 4.2 sec 0-60 time, and a 145 mph top speed. It wrings this out of a blown 1.8 litre DOHC 4 cylinder, with dual VVT-i, 16-valve with Magnuson R900 supercharger making 217 hp, but the major contributor to this performance is its weight that comes in around one metric tonne, thanks to a pretty intensive weight-loss program. Weight is the great enemy of performance, and it shows quickly on the track and at the pump. As Colin Chapman used to repeat endlessly, "simplify and add lightness".