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Cadillac flagship gets the green light, will take styling cues from Ciel Concept

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Old 07-02-13, 11:22 AM   #31
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If beancounters had their way we would all drive Civic and Corolla L's.
Even beancounters, though, don't always win. Compare last year's El Cheapo Civic with the much better one this year, for instance. Last year, the beancounters at Honda clearly went too far....and got their knuckles rapped for it.
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Old 07-02-13, 01:08 PM   #32
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Even beancounters, though, don't always win. Compare last year's El Cheapo Civic with the much better one this year, for instance. Last year, the beancounters at Honda clearly went too far....and got their knuckles rapped for it.
I'll save my whole review of the Q50S vs 3IS IS350 for an actual review thread, but short take is the bean counters touched the 3IS vs the Q50 (material wise not drive)
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Old 07-02-13, 03:32 PM   #33
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I'll save my whole review of the Q50S vs 3IS IS350 for an actual review thread, but short take is the bean counters touched the 3IS vs the Q50 (material wise not drive)
If this is true (and I'll take your word for it), then the Q50 is going to slaughter the 3IS in sales. The G37 has pretty much always outsold the IS, so I would imagine the trend to continue with the Q50. Will be a very interesting next few months for sure...
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Old 07-02-13, 04:01 PM   #34
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If this is true (and I'll take your word for it), then the Q50 is going to slaughter the 3IS in sales. The G37 has pretty much always outsold the IS, so I would imagine the trend to continue with the Q50. Will be a very interesting next few months for sure...
This might still be hard to understand but the IS is not the volume sedan, the ES is. We could say the ES slaughters the G37 in sales since those 2 are the volume vehicles. The G37 accounts for 55-65% of sales until the JX landed and its still the volume vehicle.

Thus apples to oranges.

The IS is a lower volume model and its clearly not aimed for everyone like the G37/Q50 is. That car has to stay vanilla to keep its volume and buyers. The IS is aimed at a smaller audience and one that wants a more striking car.

Also nobody can touch the lease on a G37 the main reason for buying, a cheap monthly price. I haven't seen residuals yet for the new model as I have an order sheet in front my face.
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Old 07-02-13, 06:58 PM   #35
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If beancounters had their way we would all drive CIvic and Corolla L's.
no worries, the govt and EPA will achieve what beancounters can't.

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This might still be hard to understand but the IS is not the volume sedan, the ES is. ...

The IS is a lower volume model and its clearly not aimed for everyone like the G37/Q50 is. That car has to stay vanilla to keep its volume and buyers. The IS is aimed at a smaller audience and one that wants a more striking car.
so do you believe that lexus does not want to achieve bmw 3 series sales levels with the IS? seems to me they went DIRECTLY at the 3 series with the IS. now they probably don't even have the manufacturing capacity to go head to head with bmw anyway, but i'm sure they'd love to have that 'problem'.
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Old 07-02-13, 07:36 PM   #36
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no worries, the govt and EPA will achieve what beancounters can't.

so do you believe that lexus does not want to achieve bmw 3 series sales levels with the IS? seems to me they went DIRECTLY at the 3 series with the IS. now they probably don't even have the manufacturing capacity to go head to head with bmw anyway, but i'm sure they'd love to have that 'problem'.
LOL truth

eh I'm sure they could divert plants making the FJ cruiser towards the IS
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Old 07-02-13, 08:53 PM   #37
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no worries, the govt and EPA will achieve what beancounters can't.
And with all the continued internet fear tactics we have more supercars than ever, more 400/500/1,000hp cars than ever and more MPG as well. So clearly things are okay, the auto market here continues to grow.

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so do you believe that lexus does not want to achieve bmw 3 series sales levels with the IS? seems to me they went DIRECTLY at the 3 series with the IS. now they probably don't even have the manufacturing capacity to go head to head with bmw anyway, but i'm sure they'd love to have that 'problem'.
I'm sure Lexus or any brand would love 3 series sales but that isn't going to happen. The 3 series is the status quo in class. You can lease a 320 for $299 a month, I see them here all the time. Then there are TONS of variations, wagons, convertibles, coupes, engines, diesels, hybrids, turbos etc. BMW has that game on lock down.

Lexus seems to be happy with its share as the ATS, the G37, the C-class, etc. No one is going to beat the 3 series in sales consistently.

The 3 series is also SUPER mainstream and quite vanilla. Its popular, styling is safe and BMW can't take risks. With the IS Lexus took a huge risk with the car b/c they can, which is cool. The ES is the mainstreatm car, no risks there. With the IS they can give it a crazy face and a crazy interior b/c they are aiming for those that want to be "different".

Anywhoo..getting back to the Caddy, its a shame, I think it would have been super cool. Still excited a real flagship is coming, people love BIG Caddy's.
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Old 07-02-13, 09:04 PM   #38
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Is it just me ? Or does it really look like a coffin ?
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Old 07-02-13, 10:36 PM   #39
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Is it just me ? Or does it really look like a coffin ?
reminds me of the old joke ad line... "cadillac... sooner or later you'll ride in one."
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Old 07-03-13, 10:39 AM   #40
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I'm sure Lexus or any brand would love 3 series sales but that isn't going to happen. The 3 series is the status quo in class. You can lease a 320 for $299 a month, I see them here all the time. Then there are TONS of variations, wagons, convertibles, coupes, engines, diesels, hybrids, turbos etc. BMW has that game on lock down.
Today, the Lexus IS (and other 3-series competitors) aren't as far away from BMW as some people think. The 3-series, unfortunately, is steadily giving up some of the features that made it great and got it the sales and reputation it enjoyed for years. The rise of the 3-series electric power steering, cheaper interior materials, less-competent ride/handling compromise in the suspension, and, of course, annoying electronic controls/I-Drive have all taken a significant toll. Even the auto mags which traditonally worshipped at the blue-and-white propeller are now starting to change some of their views.
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Old 07-03-13, 10:48 AM   #41
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Today, the Lexus IS (and other 3-series competitors) aren't as far away from BMW as some people think. The 3-series, unfortunately, is steadily giving up some of the features that made it great and got it the sales and reputation it enjoyed for years. The rise of the 3-series electric power steering, cheaper interior materials, less-competent ride/handling compromise in the suspension, and, of course, annoying electronic controls/I-Drive have all taken a significant toll. Even the auto mags which traditonally worshipped at the blue-and-white propeller are now starting to change some of their views.
We were talking about sales, not the way the car drives. I just drove the 2014 IS 5 minutes ago, I've driven RHD and LHD F30s.

I'm probably clearer than most on how they drive.
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Old 07-22-13, 07:55 PM   #42
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Default Akerson says Cadillac will get a larger sedan within two years

Akerson says Cadillac will get a larger sedan within two years


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It seems that during a recent affair showing off the 2014 Cadillac CTS, General Motors CEO Dan Akerson confirmed reports regarding a new Cadillac flagship sedan. According to USA Today, which Akerson was visiting, he said that a sedan larger than the XTS would debut within the next two years.

This matches up with what we heard earlier in the month about a Cadillac model that will go up against the BMW 7 Series and Mercedes-Benz S-Class (not a pricier, low-volume sedan also discussed in that article). But this is the first time a high-profile executive name has been attributed to such a report, and the first time a broad timeframe has been mentioned. This article adds that the unnamed car will be rear-, and all-wheel drive with a platform "loosely based" on the new CTS, with styling closer to that car than recent Cadillac concept vehicles. The XTS will continue production of course, as well.

http://www.autoblog.com/2013/07/22/a...hin-two-years/
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Old 08-06-14, 06:18 PM   #43
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Default Cadillac LTS flagship to bow at NY Auto Show

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There is widespread agreement across the industry that Cadillac needs a proper, rear-drive flagship sedan that completes legitimately with the Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Audi A8 and BMW 7 Series.

Fortunately, the same view is held within the company, and just such a car possibly dubbed LTS is under development. According to a high-level source at Cadillac, the new four-door, which is said to incorporate design cues from the marque's celebrated Elmiraj coupe concept, will debut at the New York Auto Show next April.

If the car needs a cheerleader, surely incoming president Johan de Nysschen is just such a person. De Nysschen doesn't arrive at Cadillac until late in the month, but certainly he will want a proper flagship to do battle with his old foes at Mercedes-Benz and BMW and old friends at Audi and Infiniti.

Autoblog's Cadillac insider dismisses today's large XTS front-drive sedan as a placeholder, and not a "real" Cadillac. The new car, in contrast, will be an honest contender against the entrenched competition, he promised.

However, the incredible new S-Class set the competitive bar much higher than anticipated, he conceded. "I didn't think they still had it in them to build such a car."

Nevertheless, Cadillac's new car will meet the challenge of the new Mercedes, he insists. Certainly the excellence of Cadillac's recent new cars suggests that the company knows how to compete with
the Germans, so there is no reason to believe that it can only build excellent compact and mid-size sport/luxury cars. And a recent conversion to the religion of low mass should assist Cadillac in its quest to deliver world-class driving dynamics along with comfort.

Inside, Cadillac advocates continue to battle entrenched bureaucracy that requires that cars' retail prices yield a certain profit margin, an approach that makes it impossible for a company that needs to re-earn its credibility to make headway using prices that are lower than those of the established competitors. This is why some General Motors cars lack content that would be expected in their segment; such content would either erode the hallowed margin or push the sticker price too high. Engineers' insistence on proper equipment in Cadillac products has pushed their list prices upward.

The solution, to help re-establish the brand, is to allow lower profit margins on cars design to recruit new customers to the brand. Other luxury marques are willing to lose money on certain halo vehicles for the same purpose. "I guarantee you the Audi R8 and BMW i8 have never made a profit," said our source.

Whatever the outcome, we now know when we will learn the result: When the new sedan debuts in New York.
http://www.autoblog.com/2014/08/06/c...hip-ny-reveal/
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Old 08-07-14, 08:50 AM   #44
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^ I believe the test mule was posted in the Elmiraj thread.

Click the image to open in full size.

http://www.clublexus.com/forums/car-...j-concept.html

If the mods don't mind, can you please merge all three of these threads into one? As the Ciel and Elmiraj concepts will most likely preview both a "LTS sedan and coupe". Thanks

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Old 08-07-14, 09:30 AM   #45
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Mercedes S Class sedan and coupe
Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.

Most likely a preview of the next 7 Series sedan and 8 Series coupe
Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.

IMO, GM will most likely do the same with a sedan and coupe from the Ciel and Elmiraj concepts.
Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 08-07-14, 09:30 AM
 
 
 
 
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