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Old 07-18-12, 08:45 PM   #181
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Courtesy of http://lexusenthusiast.com/2012/07/1...-teaser-image/

If this LS will be just an extensive refresh of the existing model - by all indications that's the case - then it will be decimated by the new S-class.

No new engines and refreshes rather than redesigns (especially on the flagship). What has Toyota/Lexus been doing for the last half decade? Compare what the Germans have done to what Lexus has done and it's clear the brand is in deep trouble. The competition is moving fast, relentlessly pushing new product and technologies year after year while Lexus drags its feet.
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Old 07-18-12, 09:18 PM   #182
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Lexus WILL call it FMC, which means Full Model Change.

As I said, while not up to the same level of changes as usual, this is far more than a facelift... as both exterior and interior will change, as well as all of the features.
I have been told too that it is indeed more than just a facelift.
Engine changes really does not mean much as Toyota/Lexus has not changed the engines on recent redesigns such as Camry, GS430, RX350, upcoming ES and upcoming Avalon. Even the last LS430 used the same 4.3 from the gen before it.
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Old 07-18-12, 09:18 PM   #183
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Quote:
No new engines and refreshes rather than redesigns (especially on the flagship). What has Toyota/Lexus been doing for the last half decade? Compare what the Germans have done to what Lexus has done and it's clear the brand is in deep trouble. The competition is moving fast, relentlessly pushing new product and technologies year after year while Lexus drags its feet.
I wouldnt go that far. In the past three years, Lexus has pushed out a new RX, GX, CT, GS and soon ES. They greatly improved hybrid technology. Just because the LS is getting another refresh doesnt mean the whole brand is in "deep trouble."

The only thing dragging at Lexus is engine upgrades. However, once they do upgrade them, I am sure it will spread across the lineup very quickly. It was the same with Mercedes who kept using the same 268 hp 3.5 liter engine for all their mainstream models when other carmakers were pushing out 300+ 3.5 liter V6s. They just responded last year (yes, in 2011 they were still using 268 hp!) and now every model has the new 300 hp DI engine.
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Old 07-18-12, 09:27 PM   #184
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Originally Posted by RXSF View Post
I wouldnt go that far. In the past three years, Lexus has pushed out a new RX, GX, CT, GS and soon ES. They greatly improved hybrid technology. Just because the LS is getting another refresh doesnt mean the whole brand is in "deep trouble."

The only thing dragging at Lexus is engine upgrades. However, once they do upgrade them, I am sure it will spread across the lineup very quickly. It was the same with Mercedes who kept using the same 268 hp 3.5 liter engine for all their mainstream models when other carmakers were pushing out 300+ 3.5 liter V6s. They just responded last year (yes, in 2011 they were still using 268 hp!) and now every model has the new 300 hp DI engine.
Well the LS is Lexus' flagship. The current one is a 2007 model, the current S-class is a 2006 model. S-class is getting fully redesigned and will no doubt be debuting a ton of new technologies and innovations. Will the LS redesign be on the same level as the S-class in regards to change and upgrades? It should be if Toyota/Lexus are moving at the same pace as Mercedes.
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Old 07-18-12, 09:31 PM   #185
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Originally Posted by RXSF View Post
I wouldnt go that far. In the past three years, Lexus has pushed out a new RX, GX, CT, GS and soon ES. They greatly improved hybrid technology. Just because the LS is getting another refresh doesnt mean the whole brand is in "deep trouble."

The only thing dragging at Lexus is engine upgrades. However, once they do upgrade them, I am sure it will spread across the lineup very quickly. It was the same with Mercedes who kept using the same 268 hp 3.5 liter engine for all their mainstream models when other carmakers were pushing out 300+ 3.5 liter V6s. They just responded last year (yes, in 2011 they were still using 268 hp!) and now every model has the new 300 hp DI engine.
Toyota and Lexus has been historically very good when it comes to upgrades to engines and transmissions. The current engines are good enough.
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Old 07-18-12, 09:44 PM   #186
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Originally Posted by LexsCTJill View Post
I have been told too that it is indeed more than just a facelift.
Engine changes really does not mean much as Toyota/Lexus has not changed the engines on recent redesigns such as Camry, GS430, RX350, upcoming ES and upcoming Avalon. Even the last LS430 used the same 4.3 from the gen before it.
Not so, the generation before the LS430 is a LS400 ...
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Old 07-18-12, 10:14 PM   #187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Burns View Post
Well the LS is Lexus' flagship. The current one is a 2007 model, the current S-class is a 2006 model. S-class is getting fully redesigned and will no doubt be debuting a ton of new technologies and innovations. Will the LS redesign be on the same level as the S-class in regards to change and upgrades? It should be if Toyota/Lexus are moving at the same pace as Mercedes.
if the S class came out in 2006 and there will be a new model in 2013, then the LS should come out in 2014, no? So they are two years early with this refresh, and I am sure they are on schedule for the 2014 debut. It probably wont be able to compete with the S class just yet, but with each successive generation, the LS has bridged the gap.
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Old 07-18-12, 10:25 PM   #188
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some people need to brush up their lexus history

i don't care if lexus is freshening up the exterior and / or interior and call it a FMC, if it's still the same chassis, suspensions, drivetrains, etc... i don't see how it's a "new" car. have fun carrying over those same general items for another 6 years and see how it's going to go against the s class, which is going to be completely redesigned for 2014 MY. don't tell me small changes on suspensions over the years, if that's the case isf has been on its what, 5th generation by now? it has suspension upgrades EVERY SINGLE YEAR.

i don't mind lexus trying to stick with the same design for another 2 years to space out the release from other lexus models, but if they stick with pretty much the same car and just different packaging but give it a new generation name, that's just an odd ball in my eyes.

of course, we know in 12 days so we will know. but what i can say? more than a few actual car guys up in the lexus chain that i know of? they all say there are changes inside and out, but it's essentially a big facelift
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Old 07-18-12, 10:28 PM   #189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Burns View Post
Well the LS is Lexus' flagship. The current one is a 2007 model, the current S-class is a 2006 model. S-class is getting fully redesigned and will no doubt be debuting a ton of new technologies and innovations. Will the LS redesign be on the same level as the S-class in regards to change and upgrades? It should be if Toyota/Lexus are moving at the same pace as Mercedes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RXSF View Post
if the S class came out in 2006 and there will be a new model in 2013, then the LS should come out in 2014, no? So they are two years early with this refresh, and I am sure they are on schedule for the 2014 debut. It probably wont be able to compete with the S class just yet, but with each successive generation, the LS has bridged the gap.
the current ls went on sale fall of 2006 as 2007 MY.

w221 also went on sale about the same time as 2007 MY. here in the US 2007 was the first MY for w221. basically both s class and the ls came out the same "year". both cars got facelift for 2010 MY, so essentially they have been on the same pace all along.

w221 had a lot of gadgets, but the ls460 also had tons as well. if anything, first few months the sales of ls were incredible (of course, also because of much lower price of swb).
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Old 07-19-12, 08:52 AM   #190
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To clear up the confusion:
This is NOT a Full model change or an all new generation. Rather, this will be a facelift.......albeit a "major" one. So yeah, major facelift............but still uses the USF model code.

Anyways, we'll see how things go by next week

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Old 07-19-12, 08:59 AM   #191
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Originally Posted by Blackraven View Post
To clear up the confusion:
This is NOT a Full model change or an all new generation. Rather, this will be a facelift.......albeit a "major" one. So yeah, major facelift............but still uses the USF model code.

Anyways, we'll see how things go by next week

Lexus LS460: Part II, Part II

This is the second facelift for this model now. 2007 was the new body style. 2010 was the first facelift. 2013 is the second facelift... When it the new model coming out...?
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Old 07-19-12, 09:03 AM   #192
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^IS also had two face lifts also.

With Lexus trying to space out their model introductions, I'd guess that we will see an entirely new LS in late 2015 as a 2016 model.
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Old 07-19-12, 09:35 AM   #193
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I wonder if there will be an LS450h?
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Old 07-19-12, 11:32 AM   #194
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I wonder if there will be an LS450h?
They should only if the they upgrade the V8 model to a 400+hp LS500 ......
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Old 07-19-12, 01:31 PM   #195
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nobody never notice the new S klasse body is the same shape as the last gen with updated front, rear and no flares?
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