How Jaguar Fast-Tracked AWD for Its Cars—And Why It Can’t Do More
08-21-12, 02:10 PM
#1
Speaks French in Russian
Thread Starter
How Jaguar Fast-Tracked AWD for Its Cars—And Why It Can’t Do More
Only Jaguar XFs and XJs with a new supercharged six will be offered with all-wheel drive, and only starting in February—months after the rear-drive versions go on sale. We’ve learned that it’s nigh-on impossible to equip the turbo-four and V-8 Jags with all-wheel drive. Join us for an excursion behind the normally closed—and dead-bolted, CCTV-supervised, security-patrolled—doors of an automaker, and we’ll tell you how the all-wheel-drive XF and XJ came to be, and why their differently engined brethren are stuck with just two driven wheels.
Oops
Our story begins in Frankfurt, Germany, in September of 2011. In a makeshift conference room, we lob question after question at Ian Callum, Jaguar’s head of design, and Adrian Hallmark, the man who runs the brand. All-wheel drive? “Yes,” Hallmark says. We’re skeptical. Jag execs were promising AWD ten years ago. So Hallmark and Callum will kick the can forward and say it’s for the next generation, right? “No, for this generation of XF and XJ.”
At that, surprised faces pop up from Blackberry duty. Bloodied—but unbowed—PR staffers share a worried look. Callum and Hallmark, we learn months later, weren’t supposed to say that.
The Lunacy Of It
Two years ago, a message landed on Mr. Ratan Tata’s desk, in the offices where he runs a global empire that had just purchased Jaguar and Land Rover from Ford. If Jaguar was going to expand in the U.S. from selling a handful of cars, it needed all-wheel drive. Now. It was going to cost a fortune to retrofit existing products, but the American market couldn’t wait two or three years for the all-new products being designed from the start to be AWD-capable. Tata signed off.
Engineers were given roughly a three-year timeline to make it work. They rushed off to a Land Rover proving ground in northern Sweden. Then a few months were lopped off. Later, the deadline was moved up another three months; execs wanted the AWD Jags to launch during the winter of 2013. They go on sale in February not because Jaguar is trying to stagger their rollout with rear-drivers. It’s because that’s the soonest the AWD cars could be finished, tested, and put into production.
How They Did It
This was a big deal. Adding all-wheel drive to a vehicle that wasn’t designed for it from the outset usually is a headache. In front-drive cars with transverse engines, automakers usually can plumb in a Haldex-style system to send some power to the rear wheels without bringing in Rube Goldberg as a consultant. But a rear-drive car with a longitudinal engine is another story. The XF and XJ, which share their basic underpinnings, essentially got new front ends.
The incredible thing is that all of this work was done exclusively to fit Jag’s new supercharged V-6 engine. An engineer tells us that there is just no way, without doing the process again, to drop in the turbo four or a V-8. The six will be the mainstream, volume engine for the XF—and probably the XJ—in the U.S., and because it’s all-new, parts specific to the V-6 needed to be designed anyway. What ended up new on the AWD cars? The front subframe, the steering rack, the engine mounts, the steering knuckle, and the front suspension geometry, to name the major components.
Jaguar sourced the transfer case from Magna and the front axle from Dana. Even though these suppliers send the same basic components to other automakers, each company configures them for their own products; Jaguar’s AWD won’t be exactly like BMW’s xDrive, even though they share their transfer cases. The all-wheel-drive Jags sit a bit higher than their rear-drive counterparts, and the front half shafts actually run through the sump.
Was all the trouble, time, and money worth it? We think so. Our guess is that Jaguar XF sales could triple in the U.S., while the XJ could see a 50-percent increase. Whether the system works well is another question. There’s no reason to think it won’t, but we’ll need to wait a few months before we can try one out and see for ourselves.
Oops
Our story begins in Frankfurt, Germany, in September of 2011. In a makeshift conference room, we lob question after question at Ian Callum, Jaguar’s head of design, and Adrian Hallmark, the man who runs the brand. All-wheel drive? “Yes,” Hallmark says. We’re skeptical. Jag execs were promising AWD ten years ago. So Hallmark and Callum will kick the can forward and say it’s for the next generation, right? “No, for this generation of XF and XJ.”
At that, surprised faces pop up from Blackberry duty. Bloodied—but unbowed—PR staffers share a worried look. Callum and Hallmark, we learn months later, weren’t supposed to say that.
The Lunacy Of It
Two years ago, a message landed on Mr. Ratan Tata’s desk, in the offices where he runs a global empire that had just purchased Jaguar and Land Rover from Ford. If Jaguar was going to expand in the U.S. from selling a handful of cars, it needed all-wheel drive. Now. It was going to cost a fortune to retrofit existing products, but the American market couldn’t wait two or three years for the all-new products being designed from the start to be AWD-capable. Tata signed off.
Engineers were given roughly a three-year timeline to make it work. They rushed off to a Land Rover proving ground in northern Sweden. Then a few months were lopped off. Later, the deadline was moved up another three months; execs wanted the AWD Jags to launch during the winter of 2013. They go on sale in February not because Jaguar is trying to stagger their rollout with rear-drivers. It’s because that’s the soonest the AWD cars could be finished, tested, and put into production.
How They Did It
This was a big deal. Adding all-wheel drive to a vehicle that wasn’t designed for it from the outset usually is a headache. In front-drive cars with transverse engines, automakers usually can plumb in a Haldex-style system to send some power to the rear wheels without bringing in Rube Goldberg as a consultant. But a rear-drive car with a longitudinal engine is another story. The XF and XJ, which share their basic underpinnings, essentially got new front ends.
The incredible thing is that all of this work was done exclusively to fit Jag’s new supercharged V-6 engine. An engineer tells us that there is just no way, without doing the process again, to drop in the turbo four or a V-8. The six will be the mainstream, volume engine for the XF—and probably the XJ—in the U.S., and because it’s all-new, parts specific to the V-6 needed to be designed anyway. What ended up new on the AWD cars? The front subframe, the steering rack, the engine mounts, the steering knuckle, and the front suspension geometry, to name the major components.
Jaguar sourced the transfer case from Magna and the front axle from Dana. Even though these suppliers send the same basic components to other automakers, each company configures them for their own products; Jaguar’s AWD won’t be exactly like BMW’s xDrive, even though they share their transfer cases. The all-wheel-drive Jags sit a bit higher than their rear-drive counterparts, and the front half shafts actually run through the sump.
Was all the trouble, time, and money worth it? We think so. Our guess is that Jaguar XF sales could triple in the U.S., while the XJ could see a 50-percent increase. Whether the system works well is another question. There’s no reason to think it won’t, but we’ll need to wait a few months before we can try one out and see for ourselves.
08-21-12, 02:50 PM
#3
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
cool story. hope jag does great with 'em!
08-22-12, 05:58 AM
#4
Lexus Champion
My comprehension seems a bit weak today.
What is/are the technical reason/s why Jaguar can't install their new AWD system on the V8 supercharged models?
I know one of the highlights was that the car was primarily designed to be RWD-only......so stuff like AWD is an afterthrought for this current vehicle.
However, the V8 engines have already been taken into account ever since the vehicles were first introduced in the market. Could the engineers still have found a way to make AWD versions of the XFR and XJL Supersport/Ultimate???
What is/are the technical reason/s why Jaguar can't install their new AWD system on the V8 supercharged models?
I know one of the highlights was that the car was primarily designed to be RWD-only......so stuff like AWD is an afterthrought for this current vehicle.
However, the V8 engines have already been taken into account ever since the vehicles were first introduced in the market. Could the engineers still have found a way to make AWD versions of the XFR and XJL Supersport/Ultimate???
08-22-12, 06:24 AM
#6
Not to bring up the obvious, but why didn't they design these with AWD capability from the start? As a global brand, Jaguar is sold in plenty of areas around the world with bad weather and high demand for 4X4 or AWD. Not doing it from the beginning, then going back and redesigning the mechanicals to make it fit, seems like a poorly executed business strategy.
None the less, I'm glad they were able to get things figured out.
None the less, I'm glad they were able to get things figured out.
08-22-12, 06:56 AM
#7
Lexus Champion
Interestingly, the Jaguar X-type had 4WD............but apparently, the X-type was labelled as one of the worst Jags in modern history (and also labelled as the top 50 worst cars of all time).
Also, sales were lackluster and many enthusiasts labelled the X-type as a 'joke'. Some were even wondering what Jag was smoking back then..........expecting this half-assed thing to compete against a 3 series, C-class or an A4.
That was back then.
Anyways, the addition of AWD for the XF and XJ is indeed a welcome (especially for those living in cold countries or places with lots of ice and snow).
Hopefully in the future, AWD will be available in the 'R' performance vehicle lineup
Also, sales were lackluster and many enthusiasts labelled the X-type as a 'joke'. Some were even wondering what Jag was smoking back then..........expecting this half-assed thing to compete against a 3 series, C-class or an A4.
That was back then.
Anyways, the addition of AWD for the XF and XJ is indeed a welcome (especially for those living in cold countries or places with lots of ice and snow).
Hopefully in the future, AWD will be available in the 'R' performance vehicle lineup
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08-22-12, 07:59 AM
#8
Lexus Champion
My comprehension seems a bit weak today.
What is/are the technical reason/s why Jaguar can't install their new AWD system on the V8 supercharged models?
I know one of the highlights was that the car was primarily designed to be RWD-only......so stuff like AWD is an afterthrought for this current vehicle.
However, the V8 engines have already been taken into account ever since the vehicles were first introduced in the market. Could the engineers still have found a way to make AWD versions of the XFR and XJL Supersport/Ultimate???
What is/are the technical reason/s why Jaguar can't install their new AWD system on the V8 supercharged models?
I know one of the highlights was that the car was primarily designed to be RWD-only......so stuff like AWD is an afterthrought for this current vehicle.
However, the V8 engines have already been taken into account ever since the vehicles were first introduced in the market. Could the engineers still have found a way to make AWD versions of the XFR and XJL Supersport/Ultimate???
The I4 and V8 engines remain in these cars essentially without change so there was no need to change the engine bay for these engines. Because these cars are due for model change soon, it was not worth the effort and expense to make a front-end change for all models and all engines (which would have been very expensive); when the new models come in 2 or 3 years time, they will be engineered for AWD from the start.
How They Did It
This was a big deal. Adding all-wheel drive to a vehicle that wasn’t designed for it from the outset usually is a headache. In front-drive cars with transverse engines, automakers usually can plumb in a Haldex-style system to send some power to the rear wheels without bringing in Rube Goldberg as a consultant. But a rear-drive car with a longitudinal engine is another story. The XF and XJ, which share their basic underpinnings, essentially got new front ends.
The incredible thing is that all of this work was done exclusively to fit Jag’s new supercharged V-6 engine. An engineer tells us that there is just no way, without doing the process again, to drop in the turbo four or a V-8 [with AWD]. The six will be the mainstream, volume engine for the XF—and probably the XJ—in the U.S., and because it’s all-new, parts specific to the V-6 needed to be designed anyway. What ended up new on the AWD cars? The front subframe, the steering rack, the engine mounts, the steering knuckle, and the front suspension geometry, to name the major components.
This was a big deal. Adding all-wheel drive to a vehicle that wasn’t designed for it from the outset usually is a headache. In front-drive cars with transverse engines, automakers usually can plumb in a Haldex-style system to send some power to the rear wheels without bringing in Rube Goldberg as a consultant. But a rear-drive car with a longitudinal engine is another story. The XF and XJ, which share their basic underpinnings, essentially got new front ends.
The incredible thing is that all of this work was done exclusively to fit Jag’s new supercharged V-6 engine. An engineer tells us that there is just no way, without doing the process again, to drop in the turbo four or a V-8 [with AWD]. The six will be the mainstream, volume engine for the XF—and probably the XJ—in the U.S., and because it’s all-new, parts specific to the V-6 needed to be designed anyway. What ended up new on the AWD cars? The front subframe, the steering rack, the engine mounts, the steering knuckle, and the front suspension geometry, to name the major components.
Interestingly, the Jaguar X-type had 4WD............but apparently, the X-type was labelled as one of the worst Jags in modern history (and also labelled as the top 50 worst cars of all time).
Also, sales were lackluster and many enthusiasts labelled the X-type as a 'joke'. Some were even wondering what Jag was smoking back then..........expecting this half-assed thing to compete against a 3 series, C-class or an A4.
Also, sales were lackluster and many enthusiasts labelled the X-type as a 'joke'. Some were even wondering what Jag was smoking back then..........expecting this half-assed thing to compete against a 3 series, C-class or an A4.
08-22-12, 10:41 AM
#10
Lead Lap
The Land Rovers don't matter because they use a completely different 4WD (vs. AWD) system and were designed with that in mind from the start.
08-22-12, 05:20 PM
#11
This could really be a game changer for Jaguar. The XJ is an incredible car, and the XF is, lack of AWD aside, a competitive car in its' class. The problem with Jaguar is that a huge number of their sales are here in the Northeast... Look at the XJ's competitors:
Lexus LS
Audi A8
BMW 7 Series
Mercedes S Class
All available with AWD, and you NEVER see a Non-AWD one around here unless it's got Florida plates.
XF's competitors:
Infiniti M
Lexus GS
BMW 5 Series
Audi A6
Mercedes E Class
Ditto, AWD on all of those and you almost never see a RWD/FWD one around here.
The lack of a 6 cylinder engine is also hurting the XF, when you look at the competition, the vast majority of sales are the V6 cars; when was the last time you saw a BMW 550i in the flesh? Even if an XF is fuel efficient for what it is, the perception of a V8 is a gas guzzler. When I worked for Lexus we'd move 15 or so GSs a month, in the time I was there I think we had ONE GS460.
When I worked for Jaguar the 3.0 S-Type was the big seller, the 4.0 was outsold 3 or 4 to 1.
If these cars don't lose Jaguar's damn near magical blend of ride and handling, these will be quite competitive I hope. But I'm the resident Jaguar nut around here My GS350, from a driving standpoint does ONE thing better than my 06 XJ8, it's incredible in the snow. Otherwise the Jaguar smacks it silly when it comes to ride, handling, steering feel and response, braking, etc. The GS is great for crunching miles, and the Stereo and Navi is way better and it's got cooled seats, and it's more comfortable for me as I'm 6 foot 3, but it's bland.. the Jaguar seems to encourage me to drive like a Madman while the Lexus is content to putter down the Jersey Turnpike at 75-80 with the cruise, AC and Howard Stern on.
Lexus LS
Audi A8
BMW 7 Series
Mercedes S Class
All available with AWD, and you NEVER see a Non-AWD one around here unless it's got Florida plates.
XF's competitors:
Infiniti M
Lexus GS
BMW 5 Series
Audi A6
Mercedes E Class
Ditto, AWD on all of those and you almost never see a RWD/FWD one around here.
The lack of a 6 cylinder engine is also hurting the XF, when you look at the competition, the vast majority of sales are the V6 cars; when was the last time you saw a BMW 550i in the flesh? Even if an XF is fuel efficient for what it is, the perception of a V8 is a gas guzzler. When I worked for Lexus we'd move 15 or so GSs a month, in the time I was there I think we had ONE GS460.
When I worked for Jaguar the 3.0 S-Type was the big seller, the 4.0 was outsold 3 or 4 to 1.
If these cars don't lose Jaguar's damn near magical blend of ride and handling, these will be quite competitive I hope. But I'm the resident Jaguar nut around here
My GS350, from a driving standpoint does ONE thing better than my 06 XJ8, it's incredible in the snow. Otherwise the Jaguar smacks it silly when it comes to ride, handling, steering feel and response, braking, etc. The GS is great for crunching miles, and the Stereo and Navi is way better and it's got cooled seats, and it's more comfortable for me as I'm 6 foot 3, but it's bland.. the Jaguar seems to encourage me to drive like a Madman while the Lexus is content to putter down the Jersey Turnpike at 75-80 with the cruise, AC and Howard Stern on.
08-22-12, 09:28 PM
#12
Pole Position
You should relook at the new GS. It's a completely different car ride-handling and even interior-wise to the older and admittedly inferior 3GS.
There's no way the XF can smack the new GS silly in terms of ride, handling and braking, in fact I'd say the boot is on the other foot.
There's no way the XF can smack the new GS silly in terms of ride, handling and braking, in fact I'd say the boot is on the other foot.
You caught that too.
08-23-12, 10:20 AM
#14
Lexus Champion
@Sulu
Ah I see. In a way, I guess it makes some sense.
I also assume that Jaguar really wanted to get AWD into the market as fast as possible.........and I guess there wasn't enough time to create AWD schematics and engineering diagrams for the four-cylinder and eight-cylinder engines.
Hehe I guess it's understandable for now.
Hopefully, for the next generations of the XF and XJ, Jaguar would now make engineering blueprints especially for the V8 supercharged models (so that we can see an XFR-S AWD and an XJL Supersport/Ultimate AWD)
P.S.
Errr.......you didn't need to make this kind of post dude. It's not like he was bashing his 3rd generation GS. (in fact he was giving both pros and cons to both his Jaguar and his 3rd gen Lexus GS).
This is a thread about Jaguar and the inclusion of AWD variants. No one was asking what is the better car here.
Ah I see. In a way, I guess it makes some sense.
I also assume that Jaguar really wanted to get AWD into the market as fast as possible.........and I guess there wasn't enough time to create AWD schematics and engineering diagrams for the four-cylinder and eight-cylinder engines.
Hehe I guess it's understandable for now.
Hopefully, for the next generations of the XF and XJ, Jaguar would now make engineering blueprints especially for the V8 supercharged models (so that we can see an XFR-S AWD and an XJL Supersport/Ultimate AWD)
P.S.
You should relook at the new GS. It's a completely different car ride-handling and even interior-wise to the older and admittedly inferior 3GS.
There's no way the XF can smack the new GS silly in terms of ride, handling and braking, in fact I'd say the boot is on the other foot.
There's no way the XF can smack the new GS silly in terms of ride, handling and braking, in fact I'd say the boot is on the other foot.
This is a thread about Jaguar and the inclusion of AWD variants. No one was asking what is the better car here.
08-23-12, 12:47 PM
#15
Lexus Champion
But because Jaguar had to make major structural changes to accomodate a new engine, the structure could be redesigned at the same time for the new engine, AND a new centre differential (on the transmission), front differential and front driveshafts.
p.s. The XJ is an aluminum car. Does anyone know if the front engine bay internal structure is also aluminum or is it normal steel? I believe that working with aluminum is much more expensive than working with steel. Is the XF also aluminum? (I don't believe so.) The article says that the XF and XJ share basic underpinnings. Is that in steel or aluminum?