My0gr81

This referred to other sources of power for fixed needs. No one wants wind mill farms on their otherwise empty fields, hydro dams or even what they call ugly solar panels on their roofs. Honestly, they need to face the realities that some compromise will be needed.

Stan93gs

This is great news. Like Mordecai, I believe if anyone can make hydrogen cars a successful reality, it's Toyota...

jaseman

As some have already pointed out, for ANY alternative fuel to be viable, you need infrastructure. You can build as many cars as you want, but without anywhere to easily refuel or recharge, no one will want to buy them.

Electric is a fairly easy fix. You can already plug it in at home, or even your office (employer permitting). And recharging stations can easily be built, tapping into the existing power grid. The two big problems though are recharge time, and an already overtaxed power grid. Much of the current electric we use is already produced by burning coal, which in and of itself, is still a dirty fossil-fuel. So we're really not solving any issues.

I think hydrogen is a great idea, and could be very viable if we can find a major player willing to get in the game. Oil companies already have a great distribution network in the form of gas stations, but would be hard pressed to want to compete with they're own product (and profits). You don't really want the government to get involved, as that generally rarely works to the advantage of either business or consumers.

But here is a crazy, off the wall idea.....
What if Toyota, Honda, or another automaker, provided refueling at dealerships? Sounds crazy at first thought, but it makes sense if they want to sell hydrogen powered vehicles. Here's how it could work:
- Toyota partners with someone who can produce the hydrogen. Could be just a distribution deal, a cash influx to help create manufacturing, or even a full blown subsidiary of Toyota itself
- Put together a 5 or 10 year distribution agreement. Gives Toyota enough time to get refueling into a majority of it's dealerships, and gives the hydrogen producer a guaranteed market until it is large enough to step out on it's own after the initial network is set-up
- Give incentives to privately held dealerships for getting on board. Allow them to set their own mark-up on the fuel, pay 50% of their cost to get refueling set-up, make them an "exclusive" hydrogen car dealer, or whatever.

If an automaker is producing hydrogen cars, and the dealer network that sells them can also supply fuel, it at least gives the consumer some piece of mind that they can indeed get fuel. And while it doesn't solve distribution to all the nooks and crannies of the country, someone like toyota has a large enough dealer network to get things up and running in most major metropolitan areas. Most larger cites have at least 2 or 3 dealers, in fact. So most people wouldn't have to go very far out of their way to fill up. While you may not be able to cross the country easily on hydrogen, you could very easily go up and down the East Coast and find a Toyota dealer (or any other major brand) every 100 miles or so. And that's what you need to get the whole thing rolling - not instant coverage of the whole country, but quickly get a large enough network to make hydrogen a viable alternative for a decent percentage of consumers.

After a 10 year contract has expired (providing hydrogen has caught on), other competitors will have come to market to provide fuel, the "partner" can branch off into it's own refueling stations, and dealers can decide for themselves whether it's economical to keep offering hydrogen.

Is it a gamble for an automaker? Sure is. But if you're gonna offer a hydrogen vehicle, you need a distribution network for fuel, or the car will never sell. It's a risk that could potentially pay off big time.

4TehNguyen

iTrader: (1)

hydrogen isnt available abundantly. It maybe the most common element but it doesnt exist on our planet in the pure form you need for hydrogen cars. Hydrogen isnt an energy source, it is an energy carrier and youll need another energy source to create the hydrogen. People are putting the cart before the horse on hydrogen "energy"

go look at any hydrogen fuel cell flowchart, all it is is a glorified car battery - it drives an electric motor...like an electric car. Why waste all these resources trying to chase this when all you have to chase is a new car battery, and you wouldnt need the complicated and expensive infrastructure a hydrogen car would need.

My0gr81

While it's true that ultimately Hydrogen is converted into electricity, it is false to equate a fuel cell to a conventional battery. It is more like a generator,where chemical energy is converted into electrical energy to power a motor directly on an as needed basis. It does so more efficiently than a gasoline powered internal combustion engine.

http://www.hydrogen.energy.gov/pdfs/..._factsheet.pdf

The gasoline engine in a conventional car is less than 20% efficient in converting the chemical energy in gasoline into power that moves the vehicle, under normal driving conditions. Hydrogen fuel cell vehicles, which use electric motors, are much more energy efficient and use 40-60 percent of the fuel’s energy — corresponding to more than a 50% reduction in fuel consumption, compared to a conventional vehicle with a gasoline internal combustion engine.