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Race engines aren't feasible in road cars for a variety of reasons - among them are that they're expensive to make, they need absurd levels of maintenance, and even given the former still have unacceptable failure rates. Race engines that are modified for general road use are still expensive to begin with and then have the added cost of the development to make them road feasible, so even then we only see them in very expensive cars (e.g., LFA).
Just to put it in perspective - in general, developing any powerplant is really expensive. That's why we often see basically the same engine across many models and even specialized models (unfortunately as with the IS-F, RC-F, and now GS-F, which are all derived from the LS600h/L combustion powerplant).
That said, Toyota's various racing groups have a lot of powerplants to choose from. F1 days saw the 3.0L V10 and 2.4L V8 (the LFA engine was likely derived from the former), and the endurance programs have the 3.4/3.7L V8s from the current program as well as the 3.4L V8 turbo from the GT-One in the 90s (which, incidentally, produced 600hp).
THIS!!!
Surprisingly for a company that does low consumer grade 4 bangers in most of their cars, Toyota has a TON of variations of the N/A V8's that they mostly do with racing. If it isnt NASCAR/NASTRUCK V8's, its all their off road vehicles in Baja racing, or even the N/A 3.4L V8 that they use in Lemans cars.
Toyota is the (unofficial) Japanese V8 Muscle car brand. (even tho not really muscle cars) And they are highly efficient compared to the American chevy V8 LS motors. I see more high mileage Toyota V8's than american V8's. Thats why I am not surprised they don't do much turbo options in their cars anymore, they perfected the Low displacement/high output V8's
Thanks gengar. Too bad they couldn't tweak a race engine and run with it. That's a lot of R&D in itself sitting in all those engines.
Agreed. I think a perfect follow-up to the LFA would have been a smaller, shorter-wheelbase car but developed in the same mold as the LFA and running the 3.4/3.7L V8 detuned to 400-430ish hp. Speaking of using more existing R+D, they could even have used the extinct LFA proto aluminum chassis. Maybe this would reduce costs to the sub-$150k range? Yes, I know this is fantasy and there are so many reasons why TMC wouldn't (or even couldn't) go forward with such a project, but it would have continued to build Lexus' cachet as far as creating driver-oriented vehicles and shunning the horsepower wars.
It's really frustrating that after the LFA, Toyota gave us the FT-86 platform just to tease us that they were bringing us driver-oriented vehicles across the spectrum - and we haven't gotten a single thing since. And it really, really annoys me that Benz is the one that winds up having a 2-seater sportscar that is in many ways a superior driver's car to even the current-gen 911. Are you really telling me that Lexus couldn't have spent the last few years stuffing the 2UR-GSE in a similar platform, driver-focused and with hydraulic steering - and charged $30k less for it, to boot?
Agreed. I think a perfect follow-up to the LFA would have been a smaller, shorter-wheelbase car but developed in the same mold as the LFA and running the 3.4/3.7L V8 detuned to 400-430ish hp. Speaking of using more existing R+D, they could even have used the extinct LFA proto aluminum chassis. Maybe this would reduce costs to the sub-$150k range? Yes, I know this is fantasy and there are so many reasons why TMC wouldn't (or even couldn't) go forward with such a project, but it would have continued to build Lexus' cachet as far as creating driver-oriented vehicles and shunning the horsepower wars.
Mercedes just did a similar thing with the SLS to AMG GT
OH MY GOD, YES! Finally! I have been waiting three and half years for this. I knew to expect the first prototype spy shots of the modular RWD models in July 2015, so glad I wasn't wrong.
Is this possibly a 6-cylinder version or just rudimentary prototype? They have been testing these in RHD in Japan for awhile, but this is probably the first prototype in North America and is likely an early LHD test vehicle. One should expect some Green Hell spy shots in the coming weeks.
Notice the differences so far:
Thank you zema for providing this information to Club Lexus! You are very resourceful.
LF-LC is such a beautiful design study. Production version is coming out quite nicely as far as the basic lines go compared to the concept. We can tell that X in the back is toned down significantly.
LF-LC is such a beautiful design study. Production version is coming out quite nicely as far as the basic lines go compared to the concept. We can tell that X in the back is toned down significantly.
That's exactly what I was about to address next. I have concerns that the next LS might somewhat look like this and has been possibly ripped off, as prototypes of that were already built internally last year.
The next LS is likely a hint of LF-LC and Tesla Model S, so I who knows what is the case there. It will be leaked somehow, someway in the next 4 to 4.5 months. Sad thing is, production doesn't begin until 15-16 months from now, meaning it will be another 1.5 years before you can even buy one.
The Youxia concept is very beautiful, but terribly derivative and comes at a very inconvenient time to Lexus. This is what happens when you play your hand too early and then take forever to execute a series production version.
So ironic how this debuts hot on the heels of spy shots being snapped of an LC prototype. The LC took 5.5 years to go from concept (2011 sign-off) to production in November 2016.
Can this stop being referred as LF-LC? The production model will be LC, as in LC500 and LC500h, not LF-LC nor SC. I am tired of publications not getting this simple updated information correct, so one hopes that CL is much better in this aspect. There is no production car called Lexus Future (LF)-anything, save for the LF-A that was renamed LFA (Lexus Fuji Apex).
Originally Posted by Hoovey2411
Mercedes just did a similar thing with the SLS to AMG GT
That's a little bit how I currently look at the LC. A 2-door model should still sit the above LC. Like a ZC, or LFR/LFZ.
That's exactly what I was about to address next. I have concerns that the next LS might somewhat look like this and has been possibly ripped off, as prototypes of that were already built internally last year.
The next LS is likely a hint of LF-LC and Tesla Model S, so I who knows what is the case there. It will be leaked somehow, someway in the next 4 to 4.5 months. Sad thing is, production doesn't begin until 15-16 months from now, meaning it will be another 1.5 years before you can even buy one.
The Youxia concept is very beautiful, but terribly derivative and comes at a very inconvenient time to Lexus. This is what happens when you play your hand too early and then take forever to execute a series production version.
So ironic how this debuts hot on the heels of spy shots being snapped of an LC prototype. The LC took 5.5 years to go from concept (2011 sign-off) to production in November 2016.
I don't know how things work over there in Japan but somehow I have a feeling they wait for stars to align so they could save money before anything goes into production. I do not believe they are indecisive about the design but rather they want to batch things when it comes to production like that V8 that debuted in RC-F which then gets streamlined to GS the same year and finds a way into LC next year and then to new LS so they never have any gaps, they are exploiting it as efficiently as they can. So yeah thing like that times hundred for every component.
That's probably why it takes half a decade to build anything, I refuse to believe they are conservative about design sing-off and that they debate it for few years. I'm not even sure they test the market as they are the last ones to get into the game in any segment so that can't be an excuse either like market is not ready bs, they have BMW to do that work for them. Last time they were the first to venture into uncharted waters was RX and that turned out quite well for them. But like I said I don't know how things work over there maybe they just have capped production pipeline so it has to wait. Maybe its simple as that.
LOL @ 600 HP. My **** !!! Lexus just doesnt have it in them, unless its going to cost 500K. I saw the mule and its no LFA replacement. Looks too high and too heavy
LOL @ 600 HP. My **** !!! Lexus just doesnt have it in them, unless its going to cost 500K. I saw the mule and its no LFA replacement. Looks too high and too heavy
That wasn't a mule, but the real deal. I don't think we've really seen any mules for the LC, as they tested those secretly longtime ago.
Thank you zema for providing this information to Club Lexus! You are very resourceful.
Talk about toning down from the concept, wow this thing look like every other boring coupe, good, I hope it won't be hot so I don't want to buy a $100k+ car
LOL @ 600 HP. My **** !!! Lexus just doesnt have it in them, unless its going to cost 500K. I saw the mule and its no LFA replacement. Looks too high and too heavy
07-22-15, 08:44 AM
Finally! I have been waiting three and half years for this. I knew to expect the first prototype spy shots of the modular RWD models in July 2015, so glad I wasn't wrong.
