mmarshall

Here is the base-model 2012 Passat review for reference:

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/car...vw-passat.html

When I recently reviewed the new VW Passat, I test-drove the base, 2.5L gas-engine version with the 6-speed Tiptronic. A CL member, in the review, specifically requested an update for a DSG-equipped version. I have driven a number of DSG-equipped VW and Audis, often with the TDI turbo-diesel, and have commented on them in other reviews. But I agreed, that, if I got the chance, I would also check out that drivetrain combination in the new Passat.

Today, I got the chance. I was back at my VW-Subaru shop for a state-safety inspection (I get free state-required inspections for the life of my car) and they still had the black TDI/DSG-equipped 2012 Passat parked outside that was there when I drove the base 2.5L model recently (both are considered demos). So, I took it out for a little while and checked it out. It was a TDI SEL Premium version with the standard 6-speed DSG (the DSG is not available on base 2.5L models). As expected, it was substantially more expensive than the 25K-list base model I tried before. This one had a base price of $32,195, a minimum of options like the other one, and listed for $33,185. I gave the diesel’s power-ratings in the other review, so they don’t need repeating here. The diesel does, however, get 30 MPG City and 40 Highway ratings….not as high as some other ratings in the past for TDIs, but still respectable.

Under the hood, there was pretty much the same layout with the TDI as with the base engine, so I won’t repeat it again. Same for the cargo area. Inside, the TDI SEL Premium version, with the two-tone beige leather interior and wood-tone trim, IMO, was substantially better-looking than the all-black/metallic-trim base vinyl/imitation leather one in the 2.5L model. The center of the leather-seats had a beige suede-covering for butt-adhesion in corners, while the edges of the seats were grained beige leather. The stereo, to my ears, sounded a little nicer than the one in the base version, too…….just the thing for James Brown and a little bit of funk/soul.

The main difference, of course, between the two cars was the drivetrain, though this car also had lower-profile tires (45-series) that quickened up the steering response and firmed up the ride a little from the softer-riding (and, IMO, preferable) 55-series tires on the base model. Generally, up to a point, the softer the ride, the better I like it….but too soft a ride degrades the handling.

The 2.0L TDI starts up with an engine START/STOP button instead of the conventional ignition switch in the base model, and there is a small but audible amount of noise from diesel-clatter at idle and low speed starts from a stop (it is almost impossible to make a compression-ignition engine as quiet at idle as a conventional gas engine). As speed increases and gears upshift, however, it becomes as quiet and refined as a gas engine, especially at cruise.The torque from this version of the TDI, as in past versions, was quite impressive, especially for a miniscule 2.0 liter displacement. Even in third and fourth gears (the transmission has six), the torque will noticeably push you back in your seat. There was no visible black smoke or soot out the tailpipe, either, as in auto-diesels of decades ago. In the U.S., we now have the low-sulfur and ultra-low sulfur diesel fuel that, some years ago, was not available here….but, depending on the station, it costs roughly what premium-gas does.

The VW/Audi DSG (Direct-Shift-Gearbox) has long been one of my favorites, and, of course, did not disappoint here either. It had a very slight rumble, in the twin-clutch system, starting up from rest, but otherwise was flawless, without the quirky first/second/third-shifting I noticed in the base-model’s 6-speed Tiptronic. Upshifts, once under way were lightning-fast…the tach needle dropped so fast to the next gear your eyes couldn’t follow it. And the transmission’s efficiency, of course, only helped the already prodigious torque in the diesel. The shift-lever had a nice fore/aft motion, without the annoying zig-zags, and a smooth, slick shifting-feel, though there were no paddle-shift levers on the steering column.

The ride, as described above, was slightly firmer with the TDI's lower 45-series tires, and the steering response was slightly quicker. Like the base model, there was flat cornering and very little body-lean, with, to my ears, about the same level of road-noise as with the 55-series tires on the base-car.

mmarshall

I won't argue about the TDI. I've always liked that engine (and/or the DSG)....but, perhaps because of the torque on the latest version here, and the new lowered-EPA rating-system, it doesn't seem to get the same MPG as earlier versions.


Electric power-steering systems have traditionally had about as much feel as dentist's novocain, but the latest systems, I agree, are much better. What I was primarily refering to, though, was not so much the Passat's tactile-feel through the steering wheel, but how quick the front tires responsded with steeering-input. That, of course, can be affected by many factors, such as road-surface, tire type/construction, sidewall-profile, tread-compound, suspension design, and, of course, the actual steering-ratio of the rack itself.

What I was refering to, though, was not the tactile road-feel of the two systems (which, IMO, felt about the same in both versions), but the actual response of the front wheels (oversteer, understeer, etc...) based on steering-input. Steering response felt a little quicker with the lower-profile 45-series tires on the TDI model, as one would expect. The 55-series tires on the base-model gave a little smoother ride, but also a little slower steering response. I myself like a smooth ride, and am willing to give up (to a point) a little bit of handling/steering sharpness for it.

Many things, though, of course, can affect the steering-response of the front tires...road surface, tire type/construction, tread compound, suspension-design, and, perhaps most of all, the steering-gear ratio in the rack itself. Some systems are also designed to vary the response based on engine and/or road-speed.

Fizzboy7

This is going to sound strange, but do today's clean diesel cars (like with this test car) have any traditional diesel fume odor? I am hoping the answer is "yes," as I like the smell of diesel. All the modern diesel pick up trucks and delivery vans I've been next to have a strange chemical smell instead. What odor does the Passat TDI get?

mmarshall

Very little traditional diesel-smell at most (which came mostly from the black soot). That has been the goal of diesel-engineers, with the modern TDI (VW/Audi) and Bluetec (BMW, Mercedes) diesels...to make modern diesels sound and run as much like gas-engines as possible, while offering better economy and good low-RPM torque. In general, they have succeeded.....though the TDIs have a small amount of the old diesel-clatter at idle.

However, if you like the traditional diesel-smell, there is always the local truck-stop or railroad-yard.....or just follow a big 18-wheeler down the road with your vents and windows open.

whoster

It depends on the kind of cycle the exhaust goes through.

The Mercedes BlueTec runs the exhaust through a urea-based solvent that may "process" the odors released by the car. The TDI I'm not too sure.

Fizzboy7

LOL Believe me, I love big rigs and rail yards (see my signature)!
So what is it automakers are putting in the diesel engines to give it that chemical smell? Some newer diesel pickups have such a strange smell... almost like a cross between ammonia and natural gas. It actually smells worse than traditional diesel fumes in my opinion.

DustinV

Good review. I myself prefer the Skoda Superb (and the Citroen C5) to the Volkswagen Passat as it's simply much better value here in Europe and quite literally the same car with a nicer exterior.

Regarding the noise levels, diesels are quite noisy when they're cold and become quieter once they're properly warmed up. This was my experience with my ex-C200 CDI and is always the case with my current BMW 118d.

And it also seems to me that diesels become quieter with age/mileage. Back in the early '80s my father drove a Mercedes 300SD Turbodiesel which noticeably "quieted down" at about 50,000 miles. I'm sure he'd still be driving it today if it hadn't been stolen in early 1991.

mmarshall

Bluetec diesels from BMW and M-B, for emissions reasons, use a urea-solution that is injected into the exhaust...the urea-tank must be refilled at roughly 10-15K mile intervals. The VW/Audi TDIs, being smaller, do not need the solution.

Fizzboy7

I haven't smelled the BMW's and MBZ's, just the pickup trucks from Ford and GM. The odor I'm referring to is on the trucks. I'm assuming they use something different than what the cars use (?).

2002GGPIS3

Nice review. I have a general DSG question. I drove a VW GTI with a DSG, and it was great, except the gear readout will disappear, if you don't change gears for a while. This is a big deal for me, so do all VW's and Audi's with DSG have the readout disappear ? I always want to know on a curvy back road what gear I am in at all times, so I know to upshift and downshift. For example on the E shift in my Lexus IS300, it always displays the number gear I am in at all times and my Mazda 3 does it as well. I want a proper car with paddle shifters someday, but I want to know what gear I am in, or there is no point !

jimmyjazz

Thanks for the follow-up!

mmarshall

Thanks.


Good question. I'm not sure I can answer it. The test-drives I've done on several VW/Audi models with DSG were considerably more than just a quick trick around the block, but I don't remember having any of them in the same gear long enough to witness the condition you describe.

mmarshall

Sure...anytime.

rdgdawg

I think VW has made a mistake discontinuing the 2.0T w/ DSG except in the GTI and rumored in the redesigned Beetle. I can't tell you the fun I had in the Wolf driving through the Tennessee mountains on my drive/return to Atlanta this week. It's a sleeper, especially to those who want to "twist" through the mountains and see this little Jetta in the rear-view

Nice write up Mike.... and for me, DSG all the way!!!

mmarshall

I agree, except that the still-available 2.0 TDI diesel with DSG is also a lot of fun. And VW, at least, unlike Audi, is not trying to phase the superb DSG (Audi calls it S-Tronic) out of the American-market.



Thanks. I probably should have done both versions at the same time, but I didn't get the DSG request until after reviewing the base (25K) model, which I thought would be a better-buy for my friend because of her limited-income.