mmarshall

A Review of the 2011 Infiniti G25X AWD Sedan.

http://www.infinitiusa.com/g_sedan/

In a Nutshell: Well-built and well-finished, but the standard Non-Sport suspension is too firm, and the 2.5L AWD version is overly-late to market.




[img]http://blog.infinitiofnorwood.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/2011-G25.jpg]/img]














I did not receive any direct requests for a G25X review, but the Infiniti G and M-series, being direct sales-competitors of RWD/AWD Lexus sedans for some time now, certainly receive their fair share of CL interest and discussion. The four-cylinder Infiniti G20 sedan, built off of the compact Nissan Sentra, was introduced back in the early 1990's, was generally unsuccessful in the American market, and Infiniti pulled it after a few years. I liked the First-Generation G20 myself, and considered buying one.....it was Sentra-based, but yet different enough to make it interesting and pleasant to drive. After a few years of hiatus, Infiniti tried again in the American market with a Second-Generation G20, this time more of a simple rebadge of the Sentra, more cheaply-designed, and, IMO, less-pleasant to sit in and drive. Once again, G20 sales faltered, and, once again, it was pulled out of America...this time, for good.

The current Infiniti G-series, as we know them, started in 2002-2003 with the original G35 and G35X sedans, introduced mainly to compete with the (admittedly) slow-selling Lexus IS300 (at the time, I owned an IS300 myself), and, of course, to have another RWD/AWD Japanese-badged competitor to the segment-leading BMW 3-series. The G35s were competent but not very well-finished sport sedans that were highly-rated by the auto press at the time for their sharp handling and ability to carve canyons with the 3-series. The G35s, introduced during a period of massive cost-cutting at Nissan/Infiniti instituted by their taskmaster/corporate owner, Renault's Carlos Ghosn, had a well-engineered chassis, but noted definciencies in the quality of interior trim, exterior paint, and both interior and exterior fit/finish. In those respects, the G35 was clearly not up to the level of previous Infiniti products like the J30, I30, and Q45. But the G35s did endear themselves to a fairly loyal group of followers (not to mention the auto press and enthusiasts), and over the next several years, noticeable improvements were made in paint, interior quality, and fit-and-finish. Additional models were introduced, like the sharp-looking G35 coupe (though the G35 coupe, despite my repeated suggestions to Infiniti, never got the AWD option the sedan did) and the later G37 coupe/sedan models with the larger 3.7L V6. The G35 coupe models looked much like the 2-seater Nissan 350Z sports car, and, while the platforms were similiar, some of the mechanics were different...as was the similiar-looking but mechanically-different (with FWD) Nissan Altima coupe. The entire G35/G37 line, despite its initial deficiencies (and, like the Lexus IS300, the lack of a manual-transmission in its first year), nevertheless went on to become one of the most successful lines Infiniti ever introduced, and went a long way towards lifting Infiniti and the mother Nissan company from the brink of bankrupcy.

For 2011, a new, smaller-engine version of the G-series is added.....the G25, with Nissan/Infiniti's smaller 2.5L V6, as opposed to the 2.0L four-cylinder on the old, unsuccessful G20. I specifically chose the AWD version for review because I've already had experience test-driving other G versions, and, of course, the G25X's arch-rival, the Lexus IS250AWD, which has the same-size V6. I also wanted to see how the G25X compared with non-turbo 2.5L AWD Subarus I have both owned and test-driven....though the 2.5L Subies, of course, are four-cylinder, not V6. While it is impossible sometimes to predict how a new model will sell, it should be noted that both the Lexus IS250AWD and non-turbo 2.5L AWD Subarus sell very well here in the D.C. area, so there does appear to be a market for that type of car....though the G25, chassis-wise, is somewhat more of a hard-edged sport-sedan than those other models (more on that below). The G25 is actually a little late to the party........IMO, it should have been introduced several years ago, as the Lexus IS250 has been on the market since 2006.

G25 models come in three basic versions....base G25, G25 Journey, and G25X AWD. Base and Journey models, of course, are RWD. All versions have the same 2.5L V6 with 218 HP and 184 Ft-lbs. of torque (not a whole lot of power, of course, for the added weight/drag of automatic transmission and AWD), and a new 7-speed Sport-Shift automatic with rev-matching for smoother manual downshifts. 7 speeds, to me, seems like overkill...I generally don't see much more of a need than about 6 or so on all but (maybe) the very highest-speed roads in Germany. No manual transmission is offered on any G25 model (a marketing error, IMO), and, in the G37, only on the Sport MT version.

Pricing for the G25, for this class of car, seems reasonable, and undercuts a number of its competitors, including the rival Lexus IS250......though, of course, you can't say that any car in this class is cheap. Base models start at 30/31K, and even my AWD model, with a few options, only ran 36K. There are some Limited-Production models with special paint/upholstery that run over 40K......I describe one of them below, in the EXTERIOR section. But, for the review, I chose a Graphite Shadow (silver-gray) Metallic one with Stone (light-gray) leather seats. Details coming up.



Model Reviewed: 2011 Infiniti G25X AWD Sedan.

Base Price: $33,950

Options:


Body-Color Splash Guards: $170

Moonroof: $1000

Trunk Mat/Net/First-Aid Kit: $195


Destination/Freight: $875

List Price as Reviewed: $36,190


Drivetrain: AWD, Longitudinally-mounted 2.5L 24-valve V6, 218 HP @ 6400 RPM, Torque, 187 Ft-lbs.@ 4800 RPM, 7-speed automatic transmission with Snow-Mode, Manual Sportshift and Downshift-Rev-Matching modes.

EPA Mileage Rating: (AWD) 19 City / 27 Highway


Exterior Color: Graphite Shadow

Interior: Stone (light-gray) Leather



PLUSSES:


Smooth V6...but with exhaust noise.

Excellent brakes.

Well-done transmission...but 7 gears may (?) be overkill.

Fore-aft transmission shifter, with no annoying zig-zags.

Good wind-noise control.

Quick steering response.

Butter-smooth steering gear.

Flat cornering.

Excellent paint job.

Good body sheet metal.

Solid-closing doors.

Superb exterior hardware/trim quality.

Rear-seat center pass-through for long items in trunk.

Gauge-pod tilts with steering-column for panel-visibility.

Clear, easy-to-read gauges/displays.

Classy, traditional Infiniti analog dash-clock.

Good interior hardware.

Well-done/fitted interior trim.

Excellent stereo-sound quality.

Nice seat leather.

Comfortable, supportive front seats.

relatively easy-to-use buttons/*****.

Solid, slick-operating dash-controller **** not as difficult to use as BMW I-Drive or Audi MMI.

Good Infiniti G-series reliability record from Consumer Reports.

Base price undercuts that of its nearest Lexus IS250AWD competitor.

Excellent 6/70 and 4/60 warranties one of the best of any Japanese-nameplate manufacturer.





MINUSES:


2.5L AWD version is late-coming.....should have been introduced some time ago.

Overly-stiff ride (IMO) for a standard, Non-Sport-Package model and 55-series tires.

Adequate daily-driving power, but relatively sluggish for a sport-sedan.

No manual-transmission option to address the low power level.

Are 7 transmission speeds really needed?

No paddle-shifters as in some competing models.

Slight road/tire noise.

Very poor underhood layout.

No body-side mouldings for parking-lot protection.

Only 5 standard exterior paint colors on the website.

No wood-trim option for interior (aluminum only).

Rear seat does not fold for extra cargo room.

Very tight rear seat for adults (not quite as tight as in Lexus IS 250/350 competitors).

Awkward, left-foot-operated parking-brake pedal.

OK but mediocre cargo-area trim for a premium-level car.

Poor rear headroom for tall persons.

Marginal front headroom for tall persons.

Temporary spare tire should be a real one in this vehicle class.

First-Aid Kit in trunk an option, not standard like with several competing vehicles.

No G-series convertible to compete with those of competitors.





EXTERIOR:

As you first walk up to the G25, there is, of course, virtually no difference in appearance, outside of wheels and trim badges, with its more expensive G37 sedan brothers. It uses the same platform, body and hardware....not that there's anything wrong with that, as the sheet-metal quality, trim/hardware, chrome, and paint-job are all very well-finished and well-done. For the G25 series, there are only 5 exterior paint colors to choose from on the Infiniti website, which is absurd for this price-class....white, two shades of silver, black, and a Blue Slate (I would choose the Blue Slate), and they are all on the dull side. There was a beautiful dark-cherry-red G25X in the lot, with matching dark reddish-brown leather seats inside, but it was a Limited-Production, special-order car...at $44,000. The paint job itself, however, as noted, even on the standard colors, is quite well-done, with good gloss, smoothness, and very little orange-peel. The exterior trim is all well-finished and well-attached....and the chrome trim is flawless. The twin side-mirror housings are both slick/snap-folding and locking with a smooth feel. All four doors, hood, and trunk-lid close with a solid thunk, and don't feel lightweight....the trunk-lid to a slightly lesser extent. As is becoming more common nowadays, there are no body-side mouldings to help ward-off parking-lot dings/nicks. Some people have suggested that I don't complain any more about this, as, like with the switch from real spares to temporary-spare tires for most on-road vehicles, body-side mouldings, for styling reasons, are going to become a thing of the past. While I respect other opinions, as far as I'm concerned, vehicles SHOULD have folding side-mirrors, real spare tires, underhood springs or struts instead of a prop-rod, and EFFECTIVE body-side mouldings mounted in a proper manner and the proper height for good door-protection. While some very low-priced cars can (maybe) be excused for omitting some of these features, in general, if I feel that, for the price, they should be on the car and they're not, I'm going to keep mentioning it.



UNDERHOOD:

Open up the solid-feeling, well-done hood, and two nice gas struts hold it up instead of a prop-rod. There is a nice insulation-pad underneath, which helps keep the engine quiet.....not not the exhaust (more on that later). The basic underhood layout, as is the case with with many upmarket/premium-grade vehicles, borders on awful. The longitudionally-mounted 2.5L V6 fits in very tightly, with almost no room to reach anything around the front or sides. It is also covered up, on top, by the usual (for premium-vehicles) big plastic engine-cover, with of course, blocks access to anything on top. Nor does the access-blocking stop there. The battery, master-cylinder, underhood computer-components, etc....are all hidden under black-plastic covers (fortunately, those covers are marked for identification). Only a few dipsticks, filler-caps, and reserviors were easily-reached (I forgot to check whether there was a traditional oil-dipstick or the oil-monitors/sensors that are used in a lot of today's premium-vehicles). Do-it-yourselfers, this car, like many of today's upmarket/premium vehicles, is simply not designed for self-service/repairs....when it comes time for underhood work, you will likely have to let the guys in the shop do it.....and let THEM take everything apart to try and get to things (that, of course, is what they are paid to do). Fortunately, the good assembly quality and better-than-average reliability record of most Infiniti sedans/coupes means that little will probably have to be done under the hood, except for routine service.




INTERIOR:

The G25's interior, like that of its other G-Series brothers, is a definite improvement in the quality of its materials over that of the early G35 models introduced in 2002-2003, during the height of Nissan and infiniti cost-cutting. Still, one thing I definitely disliked was the lack of a wood trim option for the G25 (wood is available in the G37s). This, IMO, like the lack of a G25 manual-transmission option, is another marketing error. It is explained away by the Infiniti people by saying that wood is not appropriate for an entry-level sport-sedan like the G25. I disagree. Still, to be fair, one cannot really complain about the standard aluminum interior dash/door trim...it is done very well, with a nice texture and almost Audi-precision to it......and, on the shift-console, it is combined with some nice-looking chrome as well. The G25's interior, though, is generally not the place for tall people. Headroom was tight in the front seats unless you adjusted the seat-cushion all the way down and gave the seat-backs a little rake, and even then my ever-present cap barely cleared the optional ($1000) moonroof housing. Headroom was even tighter in the rear, and, with the drivers' seat adjusted for me, there was very tight legroom as well for tall persons....though I'd say the rear seat, overall, was not quite as bad for adults as that in the competing Lexus IS250/350.

The front seats were quite comfortable and supportive, and I was quite pleased with them......some side-support is needed with the cornering this car is capable of (more on that later). Not many factory-standard seats, particularly in Japanese-nameplate vehicles, do a good job of combining comfort AND support, especially for large, heavy persons, but this is one that does. The seat-leather, unlike the imitation stuff you find on some German vehicles, was genuine, and felt nice. All of the other trim materials inside....door panels, dash surfaces, headliner, sun visors, arm rests, etc.... felt pleasant, solid, and high-quality....as, of course, the aformentioned aluminum trim. In the center of the dash is, of course, the oval, classy, chrome-jewel analog electric clock that is traditional with Infiniti vehicles. The stereo sound quality was well-above average, though I wouldn't call it a killer.......an even nicer 10-speaker Bose system is available as an option. The radio stations could be adjusted 3 different ways......with the big scroll-****-controller, the controller's side-buttons, or the traditional pre-set 1-2-3-4-5-6 buttons. Though I'm not usually a fan of dash-type controllers, I generally found the system in the G25 more user-friendly than the awful BMW I-Drive or Audi MMI systems. Still, given the choice, I'll take old-fashioned stereo/climate controls.....I still find them much easier, overall, to use than dash-controllers. The G25 does still have some of those, fortunately, and that makes some of the stereo and climate functions easier to use......you aren't necessarily locked into the controller-****. All of the *****/buttons/levers are solid, well-designed, and have a positive, high-quality feel, almost like a Honda/Acura product. Only the small left/right adjustment switch for the twin-outside mirrors felt less than solid, and, even then, it wasn't bad.

The steering-column, like the dash, lacked a wood-trim option for the wheel-rim, but included a manual tilt/telescope feature, and a feature common on many Nissan/Infiniti vehicles.....the entire gauge-pod and instruments tilt up and down with the wheel. This is helpful for some drivers, of course, because it makes it less-likely for the wheel-rim to obscure some instruments or other dash features. The primary gauges themselves were simple, easy-to-read, and, unlike the former yellow-orange dash-lighting of the first G35s and some other Nissan products (which, BTW, I never liked), now has Lexus-type back-lit, electro-luminescent white lighting. The console-compartment storage bin, unlike the cheap plastic-lock hardware on many vehicles, has a nice-sounding/feeling snap-lock on it.





CARGO AREA/TRUNK:

Open up the solid-feeling trunk lid (with nice, slick-operating hinges), and the cargo area is a fairly good-sized one for this size sedan, but not particularly well-finished for this price-class. The rear seats don't fold down for added cargo space, but there is a small center pass-through in the rear-seat for long, narrow items in the trunk like skis, fishing rods, etc... (Some sedans/coupes omit the rear-seat-folding feature, not necessarily as
a cost-cutting move, but to help with rear-unibody rigidity for strength...folding-rear seats often mean fewer reinforcing cross-braces in the rear). The carpeting on the floor is an OK but rather thin-grade covering.....there is no carpeting at all on the trunk's side-walls. Underneath the trunk floor, under a secondary-foam tray with the jacking tools, lies a temporary spare tire...this vehicle, IMO, is in a high-enough price-class where it should have a real spare tire/wheel. My test-car had the optional ($195) trunk mat/net/first-aid kit option.....several of the G-series competitors have a First-Aid kit standard.





ON THE ROAD:

Start up the 2.5L V6 with a nice engine START button and the proximity-key/fob in the vicinity (A START/STOP button for the engine, BTW, is something else I'd like to see standard on all vehicles, but I understand the added costs of installing it, because of more electronics, sensors, relays, etc...). Anyhow, the V6 fires up smoothly and idles quietly at rest. Once the oil pressure comes up and you hit the road, though, exhaust noise definitely makes itself known, particularly under moderate or greater acceleration. It has almost exactly the same torque (187 ft-lbs.) as that of the same-sized V6 in the Lexus IS250AWD (184 ft-lbs.), so neither engine, with the added weight/drag of the automatic transmission and AWD hardware, is going to be a powerhouse. Acceleration, with both of them, is adequate, like with the 2.5L non-turbo AWD Subarus, for most normal daily-driving, but these are clearly not vehicles to go out with for Friday-night stop-light contests. And the Infiniti 2.5L V6, unlike the Lexus 2.5L, has a much louder exhaust under acceleration....perhaps in an attempt to give it more of a sport-sedan-image. Since the drive train is not that responsive, you also tend to drive with a higher throttle-opening than in some other sport-sedans, and that, of course, means more load on the engine, and a higher-level of exhaust noise. A manual or twin-clutch-auto-manual would (maybe) help with the acceleration, but neither is offered in the G25, and the IS250 only offers a traditional manual in the RWD version, not the AWD.

The 7-speed automatic in the G25X was smooth, flexible, and quiet, but, for most daily-driving, I question the need for seven gears. Not only does it make the transmission more complex and expensive to produce than necessary, but it makes for a lot of shifting as well, which means wear on the internal parts (in my experience, six gears is usually enough...even five in some cases, with good ratios). And, during warm-up, and especially at less-than-expressway speeds, you can get annoying beeps in the shifter when the computer locks you out of up-shifting in some gears. Other than that, though, it is a nice, well-designed transmission, and helps to make as good use as possible of the car's relatively low power-to-weight ratio. The shifter has a nice, smooth-but-positive fore/aft motion with no annoying zig-zags, but lacks the paddle-shifters found on many sport-sedans......and on its rival IS250.

The chassis is classic sport-sedan, perhaps TOO classic for the standard, Non-Sport-Package suspension and 55-series tires on my test car. The firm ride (I'd actually call it stiff) was OK on glass-smooth surfaces, but hit any kind of road imperfection/frost-heave/pothole, and the resulting thud and jolt from the tires was more reminiscent of a super-sport package with stiffer undrpinnings and 35 or 40-series tires than 55s and a standard set-up. I checked the tire PSIs before take-off like I usually do, and all four were within a pound or two of recommended PSI's, so I know the tires weren't off. This is just a very firm standard suspension, that's all....admittedly not as stiff as on the rock-hard Lexus IS-F (the IS250 is somewhat softer) or Mitsubishi Evo, but stiff enough that I probably wouldn't recommend the Sport Package, even though I admittedly didn't cross-test that package. Handling is about what you'd expect from stiffness like this....relatively quick steering response and flat cornering, with little understeer (the AWD, of course, also helps with added grip in the corners). The handling, as with the ride, felt more like lower-profile tires than the 55s on my test-car. The power-steering pump/linkage on the G25X did not have quite the magic/telepathic road feel found on some BMWs (but, then again, almost nothing else does), but did produce a butter-smooth sensation through the steering-column and wheel. So, for handling-enthusiasts, this seems to be a chance to get a real sport-sedan suspension at a low price (and, to boot, having less-expensive 55-series tires to replace), without having to pay extra for the Sport Package. But, likewise, for those who prefer ride comfort......look elsewhere.

The brakes were very well-done.....I was quite impressed with them. They had a classic German sport-sedan feel, with quick response, no sponginess, and firm, even modulation. The brake-pedal placement was not exactly where I would have preferred to keep my big size-15 clown-shoes from hanging up on the side/bottom of the pedal going from gas-pedal to brake, but it was a very minor issue..no real problem.





THE VERDICT:

The G25X is a very interesting car, especially compared to its rivals in the marketplace. It should have, IMO, been brought to the American market several years ago, but, as they say, sometimes better late than never. Its price, though not chump-change, is certainly reasonable, and it appears to be well-built, with good fit-and-finish. The standard Infiniti warranty (something I didn't talk about before) also bears notice, with arguably the best coverage available in the American market from a Japanese manufacturer. Both Lexus and Infiniti give you 6/70 on the Drivetrain, and both used to give you 4/50 on the Bumper-to-Bumper coverage, but Infiniti has now increased that to 4/60. That, of course, in addition to the Roadside Assistance and Rust-Through Warranties. The AWD, of course, aids handling and winter-traction...even more so the traction, with the taller, more slick-road-friendly 55-series tires. The interior trim is well-done (if you don't mind the lack of wood trim), and uses nice, pleasant high-quality materials. It offers a firm (yes, stiff), sport-sedan chassis for handling-enthusiasts without the added expense of a Sport Package, albeit, of course, at a significant price in ride comfort. Best of all, unlike the unreliable Infiniti QX56, with the typical Infiniti sedan/coupe, one is not likely to have to put up with frequent breakdowns or repairs....these vehicles are generally reliable, according to Consumer Reports.

If it was my money, though, I'd (probably) take the rival Lexus IS250AWD...or wait till Subaru gets the bugs out of the present-generation (2010-2011) Legacy/Outback. Audi, of course, offers AWD Quattro sedans (as does BMW, with some of its sedans/coupes), but none of the German models (especially Mercedes) has the kind of reliabilty that Infiniti G and M-series sedans do. The IS250AWD, even with 45-series tires, rides noticeably better than the G25X, and although not as responsive as the G25, still has respectable handling. Both, of course, with the low-power 2.5L V6s and the weight/drag of the AWD hardware and auto-transmissions, are a little sluggish, but, with most of the driving I do, that's not an issue. The IS250, yes, does cost slightly more, but, though I'm not Bill-Gates rich, I can afford one without risking a repo. Both the IS250 and G25 have lousy rear seats for adults (the IS250, more so), but, again, that is generally not an issue with me, who often drives alone. And, last, the IS250 doesn't skimp on paint-color choices like the G-series does.

So, there you have it. And, as always............Happy Car Shopping.

MM

jason60050

No Bose Stereo option???

mmarshall

According to the literature, there are a number of audio, recording, and sound-system options and packages........a 10-speaker Bose premium-stereo is one of them. My particular car did not have it....but the standard stereo was nothing to laugh at, either.

ecr527

Nice review Marshall!!! I didn't even know Infiniti was doing a G25!!

TripleL

Nice review mmarshall.

I agree with you its a good addition to their line up albeit late to the game. When I purchased my car I looked closely at the G35x that was available at that time and yet still bought my IS so you know where my head is at on this Interestingly my father in law liked the G35x enough to buy one then.

As for ride I find my IS is quieter and rides much nicer than his G so I'm not surprised that is still true although it have been 5 years so maybe I should be surprised that they haven't caught up. I will say his G is hella fast, but I'm also pretty sure I've experienced that great speed in his car more then he ever has

LexFather

NIce review Mike. The pics show NAV but the G25 does not have that option.

I think it will be an every better value leader for people that want a nice luxury badge for a very good price. I can only imagine this thing will lease under $300 a month since the G37 is around $319 a month. A lot of car for the money for those that don't care about speed and HP.

mmarshall

Thanks

There's been one or two CAR CHAT threads on it before my review, but, you're right.....Infiniti hasn't done many ads for it. That's strange, too, because the G25X seems (IMO, at least) to have been introduced specifically to compete with the hot-selling IS250AWD. In my area (Washington D.C. suburbs) the IS250AWD handily outsells the RWD version.

The G25 (not surprisingly) seems to have one of the same problems the IS250 does.....a rather weak engine for a purpose-designed sport/luxury-sedan. And the IS250, in RWD form, has a manual-transmission option to maybe add a little performance...the G25 doesn't.

mmarshall

Thanks, Mike.


Sometimes the attached images are the weak points of my reviews. I don't have a digital-camera, or the skills/computer-ability to download self-taken shots. So, I usually rely on Google images, which are easily copied and attached. But, to be honest, sometimes the Google images are great, and other times they are inaccurate or just plain s**k. The G25 is a new vehicle in the American market, and, as is sometimes the case, good images are presently rather hard to find for new models, especially lower line/entry-level ones like the G25 (it is, of course, condsidered the entry-level vehicle in the Infiniti lineup).


Yes, but G25s can vary quite a bit in price...starting at some 31K, and running to well over 40K for the special-production models. The 36K version I test-drove, from the dealer stock, seemed about average-priced for the AWD models they had there.

mmarshall

Thanks.

Though late, the Infiniti marketers may have finally looked at the IS250RWD/AWD's good sales and decided they wanted a piece of the action.

Lexus, of course, now has the IS350AWD to compete with the G35X/G37X (I recently did a review of the IS350AWD...I'm sure you saw it). The IS350AWD, ironically, is another new vehicle late to the party...that was one area where Infiniti was ahead of Lexus, and still is, because the G37 has a manual-transmission option on the Sport model, and the IS350 doesn't have one at all.

Agreed. The entire IS line (except for the rock-hard IS-F) definitely rides better and quieter (less exhaust noise) than the G25, though I can't vouch for the new G37 because I haven't driven the latest version. The G25, as I pointed out in the review, has a standard, non-sport chassis that is as stiff (or stiffer) than the Sport-Package in a number of competing models. I didn't try the G25 Sport Package, but, even so, based on the standard suspension/tires, I'm not sure I would recommend it, especially for street use.

CDNROCKIES

Good review...as expected by now...Mike.

I will quibble with you however on your continued opposition to 7+ speed transmissions. The added fuel economy that they provide is indisputable.

I have yet to read of any case of the 8 speed in the F providing one single issue as far as reliability or longevity. Your contention has always been that the more gears you involve, the more potential issues that can occur. That simply has not been the case with the F....a car that gets driven harder and pushes through the gears more than any average car.

I can't comment on the LS as I'm unclear if it has experienced any issues. I can't imagine that it's any less reliable with a less powerful engine that doesn't get pushed as hard.

In addition, with the upcoming emissions (CAFE) standards that are about to be imposed, it is next to impossible for a manufacturer not to consider more gears to help increase fuel economy.

I appreciate and respect your car knowledge as always Mike, but this is one aspect where you seem dreadfully stuck in the past.

metalgear

Great review! I'm starting to like the exterior styling of the new G series especially the sedan. This car has 7 gears? It seems that a lot of cars nowadays are having more than 6 gears. Too bad though it doesn't come with a manual transmission.

IS-SV

Agreed, because in short an advanced multispeed advanced tranny has nothing to do with higher cruising speeds in Europe or whereever.

I noticed the usual internet hearsay about magical BMW steering (again), not that it matters becuase it has nothing to do the subject vehicle here.

I do agree with the general verdict of the review. But I have doubts about the miniscule sales volume potential of this AWD sedan. For example in California I have seen only 2 of the AWD IS250's in the last 3 years, so I know they sell very few out west when compared to hugely successful RWD IS250.

Joeb427

iTrader: (1)

Ditto!

Not liking that model.

rdgdawg

As always Mike,

About like I thought, my only comment: I'd take my old IS250 AWD over it all day long!!!!

mmarshall

Thanks.

Of course, I respect your opinion, but, using your theory of the more gears, the better the fuel economy, then why not just go to a CVT instead of tacking on more and more gears? They are not only lighter than a 7-8 speed, but cheaper to produce. Although they are still being perfected (and some still have drivability problems), most of them today can easily take the 184 ft-lbs. of torque that this engine produces. In fact, Nissan, Infiniti's brother division, uses CVTs on some larger, more powerful 3.7L V6s.

True, but the F is a fairly new product, only a couple of years old. Not many of them, right now, are likely to have a lot of miles on them.

The LS, of course, has a big V8 with a lot of torque......for most driving, it certainly doesn't need 8 gears for flexibility. However, the LS marketers may have been trying to appeal to potential German buyers as competition for the BMW 7-series, Audi A8, and Mercedes S-Class. Those cars often travel on the unlimited-speed sections of the German Autobahn at well into triple-digit speeds. Under those conditions, 7 or 8 gears might make some sense......if fuel-economy and RPM-related engine wear is going to be an issue.

Some of the best-selling cars on the road, BTW, are still using 4 and 5-speeds. It is not just a matter of being "stuck" in the past. For many cars, it's not really the past, but now. However, I do agree that 4-speed automatics, in luxury/upmarket cars, just don't cut it any more....and I did criticize both the new Cadillac DTS and Buick Lucerne for their inflexible 4-speeds.