hadowman and Discovery Automotive... STAY THE **** AWAY FROM!!!!!!, Discovery Automotive wrecks a FGT

Here is a post from another forum which was posted about Peak's experience and the fact that his car was destroyed...

First and Foremost, I am glad Bill is ok. I believe after seeing the scene of the accident and what the car was put through that in any other car he would be dead. Thank you once again to the FGT Design team for building such a strong car. It saved his life.

Secondly, A HUGE Callout and Thanks to Michelle of Classic Insurance who had to take control of this situation and literally saved the day! I will go into more detail on a different post about my experience with Michelle, Drew and the Classic insurance family which without their help and support and professional aptitude this situation would have been incredibly worse!

I don't have the written eloquence of Shadowman or the ability to twist and curve the english language so the following story will be limited to the facts, what I was told and laid out rather plainly for clarity and understanding...

Despite multiple PMs asking me to tell the story of my first dealing with Bill AKA Shadowman, and then end result which occurred before the rally, I did not want to do so without giving Bill full opportunity to make this situation right. (Which he still has not done)

I also did not want to bring a negative tone or conflict to the Rally with the current circumstances so I told Bill that I wanted to keep it quiet.

His post early this morning and emails has told me his intentions and as such I feel it is important that both sides of the story are told so that GT Owners can decide the risks they are taking with a Tuner / Vendor who will possibly work on your car.

I sent my Car to Shadowman.

This was my result.

untitled_fgt_new_new.bmp ( 673.18K ) Number of downloads: 354


I sent my 2006 Heritage Twin Turbo to Shadowman along with Chip Beck's car to get ready for the last FGT Rally.

There had been a bunch of small issues that I originally wanted the GT Guys to go through and fix however they simply couldn't get out this way and logistics did not seem to be working to send the car to them.

In talking to Chip he suggested that perhaps we give our cars to Shadowman to work on, his only bad experience with Bill being the final bill being so expensive compared to other Tuners. Since you usually get what you pay for, this wasn't deemed a major issue given the nature of the things I wanted done being very minor and decided to send him the cars.

When the cars arrived Shadowman in his usual forum persona sent me a long email and pictures of the car in his shop and his plan to go forward and "tweak my gal"... This went on for a couple of days with the minor observations he was making about this and that.

It was during these updates that he started asking for a copy of my insurance card. I simply told him that it was insured however he insisted on getting a copy of it to prove that it was insured before he would "test" drive it later that night when the hiways "cleared"...

Although warning bells were going off and this seemed weird, I sent him a scanned copy of the card. With all the tuners that I deal with I have never been asked for a copy of the card but rather they would show me that they had insurance as they run legitimate businesses.

I received the following email from Bill on the evening of the accident...

__________________________________________________ ________________________________

From: Shadowman
Date: Sat, 11 Sep 2010 21:01:49 -0700
To: 'Raymond Hofman'
Subject: RE: Shadowman

It remains my pleasure Ray

Thank you for the data points.

Your gal and I are about to embark on our "get to know each other"
adventure.

First a fuel stop ....... then a methodical cruise on the highway after
which I will bring her into boost and see how she responds while adjusting
the boost controller.

Takes care

Bill aka Shadowman
www.discovery-automotive.com
__________________________________________________ ______________________________

I went to bed that night about 2am with my final text message being one to Bill asking if he was ok... as I hadn't heard anything.

I woke up the next morning to an email from Bill stating that he had a small incident with the car, that he had been driving like a little old lady and the car had went off the road and down an embankment, and that he didn't know what had happened. He followed up with the facts of the towing company, the police report number and that he was hurting but ok and heading home and that we would talk later in the day.

Of course my first objective was to make sure he was ok when we were able to talk later that afternoon giving him time to rest a little. He stated that he was banged up a bit but fine, and that he had walked / crawled up the embankment, had been checked out by the hospital and that despite having a headache he was ok.

Since establishing that he was ok my next question was about the car and it's condition. This was when things started to get a little "shady"...

He got a little defensive stating that he didn't really know as he wasn't really in the mindset to pay much attention to it given the circumstances. I responded with asking some more details of the accident and that surely he had SOME idea of the condition and what happened to help me out 2000 miles away with some sort of picture of what the state of the car was left in. Again, he recounted his story that he was doing 65 mph down the hiway driving like a "little old lady", that all of sudden the car went right off the road, jumped a curb and slid down an embankment. He told me time and time again that there were no skid marks, nothing out of the ordinary had been going on and had no idea what happened.

He finished by saying that "he would be more worried about the possible damage done by the tow company pulling it up the embankment than the actual damage done by the accident"

While this made me feel much better about the condition of the car and that he was alright, I asked him if he had or could take any pictures to which he replied that he would "try and get to it that week IF he felt up to it" and that he would get back to me later in the week.

My next question to Bill was how are we going to handle this?

His response was that while he was sorry for the situation, it really was none of his responsibility and that was why he had asked for my insurance card.


This gave me great cause for concern at the lack of care given the situation and the somewhat shadowy story. I immediately called Shelby of Elite Autos and Alex Shen at SP Engineering to try and make a plan to see the car the next morning. Given the story I was unsure if it was something that we would want an insurance claim on and if it was as minor as Shadowman had relayed that we would figure out the damage and what it would take to repair it. It was decided that going to pick up Shelby would add a lot of time and that since Alex was already in Los Angeles it would be more efficient to have him go with me to look at the car and assess the damage.

I immediately flew to LA and stayed with Alex that night in preparation to be at the Towing Company as soon as they opened up the next morning. We discussed the situation and talked cars as I relayed Shadowman's version of the story and decided that it was probably not a big deal and would see in the morning.

Note that the incident was Saturday night and I arrived at the tow company Monday morning at 8am

When we arrived and signed in to see the car, the tow truck driver first asked where the "Pilot" was?? Kind of laughing at our confusion he said "you know, the driver, the pilot... flying through the air that far and that fast you have to call yourself a pilot!"...

gut sink in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1....

As soon as we walked through the doors and he turned the light on I turned to Alex and apologized for wasting his time.

I can honestly say that I have never seen a GT in as bad of a wrecked condition as this car. We continued to talk to the tow truck driver to get a better picture of what had happened, where it happened etc.

He stated that he wasn't sure what had occurred except that the section of the road where it had happened is the "local drag strip" and is a 3 mile straight away where everyone "tests" their cars out... he told us that he would take us to the scene after we were done taking pictures.

I will follow this post up with additional pictures with more detail but in summary there wasn't a body panel left without damage and every frame support in the back was ripped apart. The transaxle was GONE having been exploded by impact into what appeared to be a tree gauging by the bark and sticks that had punched holes through the exhaust and even the turbo housing that was left on the car. The impact had sheared all the engine mounts and actually pushed the engine forward into the firewall.

A quick assessment of the driveline showed no apparent issues, tires looked good and intact, air bags never went off indicating the impact was from the rear a fact backed up by the visible damage.

There was a vacuum line blue taped from the engine bay to the outside of the car and in through the passenger window which was sitting on the seat indicating that he had been driving and monitoring the boost on that gauge... Alex being a Tuner himself first looked at me after seeing this and had a VERY puzzled look on his face as to the danger and method of trying to monitor boost in this manner....

Next stop - Crash site...

We followed the tow truck driver to the scene and tried to put back the pieces of the puzzle. It didn't take long.

Shadowman had told me that there were NO skid marks or anything and as such couldn't figure out what happened. That information was definitely inaccurate.

Coming around a wide sweeping right hand turn there was indeed a very long straight away section of road which the driver backed up by saying "this is the local drag strip where people test their cars"... He followed up by saying that the road was dry that night, there was no fog or moisture and nothing that would have made for weird driving conditions.

Bill had told me he was in the "slow" lane or inside lane and that was backed up by the multiple sets of skid marks on the pavement.

Where the road straightened out there were two long sets of black marks at the end of which was a small undulation in the hiway which when video was taken of the traffic going by, could see a definite settling of the suspension... Now I cannot say that these marks were in fact left by my car as Shadowman says that he was not speeding and was simply going in and out of boost in 3rd at 65 mph, driving like a "little old lady"...

Shortly there after, 150 ft or so was the marks on the pavement which were in the same lane and DEFINITELY left by my car as the back end came around and went sideways off the road through the gravel. It looked like it then hit a tree in the drivers door of about 18-24 inches in diameter and broke it off which appeared to have spun the car around so that when it left the road it was facing straight backwards.

It looked like it then flew through the air as the embankment dropped sharply and broke off another tree about 20 - 30FT off the ground, that was 60-70FT from the edge of the road.

Now the "Pilot" comment made sense. It looked like He had truly flown the car backwards through the air about 30 feet off the ground before impact a second tree hitting it directly dead center in the back of the car, exploding the transaxle, driving the engine forward into the firewall...

This sheared the tree in half which when the car dug into the ground ended up landing on the top of the car and rolling off to the side resting against the side of the car which was the final condition according to the tow driver.

He went on to say that they spent about 4 hours retrieving the car with multiple trucks to ensure that they did no damage to the car... I told him I appreciated that but given the condition of the car it truly wouldn't have made a difference.

We found blue and orange paint all over the tree, parts of the transmission 100 ft away from the tree and all kinds of engine parts scattered everywhere.

It was at this time that I had finally received a call from Bill asking what I was doing in California as I had left him some text messages and voicemail saying that we wanted to come by and talk, see if he was ok etc.

He told me he was at the shop and had been piddling around doing this and that and that "we come by I guess if you want to stick your head in and say hi"... it definitely did not sound like he was happy we were there.

We showed up and he greeted us at the gate and invited us in to the shop. In the process of conversation I told him that I was so glad he was ok, and that after seeing the car it was a miracle he was alive. I went on to say that given his explanation of the cars condition and what we saw, it was a little shocking as to the extent of the damage, that we had been to the crash sight etc and had a really good idea of what had happened but wanted to hear it from him.

He looked at me and said "Ray, I could tell you what really happened but I will never tell you what really happened, I can't..." which basically told me, this is my story and I am sticking to it.

He went on to explain that he is just a guy who operates out of his garage, and that he works on "gals" as a service to the community only and really is not set up as a proper business cause he doesn't think he has to. This despite having a H1 Alpha parked right beside us and a brand new Lamborghini SV LP670 he told me he really has NO money and can do nothing for me... That this situation was a miss aligning of the stars and just a moment of bad luck and that it was really not his responsibility. BUT he can help me out in other ways, working on my gals in the future for a discount etc...

HUH?

He then went on to beg me not to end his business with a bad report. That he was just a small guy trying to make ends meet and again had no money or ability to do anything. That he had NO business insurance (garage keepers etc) because it would be too expensive... and asked me what I was going to do....

I told him that bad situation or bad luck or whatever, as a business owner who portrays himself as such with his website, reports on the forum etc.. that I had TRUSTED him with the car and to do the right thing. That again, I was not mad, but rather glad that he was ok and while sad about the car, it was just a car, a thing, not exactly easy to replace after everything was done to it but still replaceable all the same.

I went on to say that how I handled it would completely depend on how he handled it. That as business owners we incur risk which is offset by the reward of charging and tweaking on over 35 "gals"... run the numbers on what he has done there for revenue on FGTs alone...

I explained that there is an unwritten code between exotic car owners that if you ever step behind the wheel of someone else's car, that you would be responsible for the car if something happened. That is the reason I don't drive someone elses car. Furthermore, when you send it to a BUSINESS specializing in tuning any high end cars, it is with the understanding that if something happens to it while under their care it would be taken care of no questions asked.

There are two instances that I know of where tuners destroyed cars on a test drive prior to this one, and in both cases the tuners took care of the situation, immediately bought the car from the owner and handled it on their end. That this is what I expected to happen and that was the right thing to do.

He left the conversation by saying that he simply could not do that, and felt that he really had no responsibility in the situation and basically, that I was on my own.

I asked him what would have happened if the car had went left instead of right and he had killed someone... should my business and family be at risk because of the way he was driving a car and taking on said responsibility...

Completely shocking, he responded that is the reason he gets copies of insurance cards and truly felt it was the owners responsibility solely..

I told him the ball was in his court and that I would leave it to him, that either he could do the right thing or not and that if he did the right thing, it would show the quality of business man and character he had, and that if he didn't it would tell the same.

He called back a couple of days later to say that he had thought about the situation and in an attempt to "Do the right thing" had submitted a claim on his personal homeowners policy through State Farm, and to expect a call.

At this point in time we had already been talking to Michelle at Classic to explain the situation and ask for advice on how to handle it. When I received the call from the State Farm rep on behalf of Shadowman I knew right away that the situation was not going to be good. She asked several questions on the sequence of events and said that the next step was to contact my insurance carrier.

In talking with Michelle after the conversation she had with State Farm, the situation was basically that State Farm would look at the claim only after my insurance would have to deny the claim, and that the chances after denying the claim and leaving it to State Farm of being approved were very slim.

It was at this time that we decided we had no other choice but to bite the bullet, and take care of this ourselves.

We talked to Bill and he said that he was confused as his personal policy had said they would put a claim in but that was all he was willing to do.

End result was basically we were left to pick up all the pieces and Michelle and Classic insurance did their job going above and beyond. They handled everything promptly and worked very hard despite a lower agreed value on the car to make me "whole"...

I consigned myself to learning from this experience, dealing with the possible rate increases in the future for having a total loss on a policy with numerous cars on my insurance, and keeping it quiet before the rally still not pressuring Bill and leaving it up to him as he promised to make it "right"

Then, two days ago, Michelle calls me quite upset at the fact that Bill was now submitting a claim for personal health costs etc against my insurance.

We contacted Bill to basically say this was not only adding insult to injury and added expense to my insurance but that this was definitely not being done in good faith as he promised.

It was at that time that I gave him an ultimatum to do the right thing, make up the much lower amount of difference to make the situation whole on the car, that I would eat future increases in costs etc and definitely expected him not to put another claim against my insurance for a situation he created...

He relayed by phone to my wife that it was never his intention to jerk us around, that he would try and do the right thing and that he understood that he had put us in a horrible situation.



That was yesterday, and judging by his post we will be waiting for him to do the right thing....

I hope he does, as many of us would do if the situation was reversed.

In summary though, it is a lesson learned when sending your car to anyone, no matter what their reputation, business setup or whatever to make sure you are properly covered in case of a bad situation

Shadowman's Horrific Accident

I have thought about making this post for nearly 5 weeks now and just thinking about it causes my stomach to turn so I need to do this so I can move on.

Now if I said nothing more by than I was in an horrific accident nearly 5 weeks ago followed by sharing the results likely enough would have been shared however;

Sadly the story has more to it and since I have been made aware now by many that they have been made aware of it I feel it important to share it openly so that folks see and understand first hand that accidents happen and often times during the most innocent of circumstances.

Let me begin by sharing that I was taken to the hospital for a brief stay and then within an hour of my release I let the gal’s owner know what had happened; this was at 1:00am in the morning to which his initial response was; “are you alright” and once I said sore but that I should be fine I was then asked how bad is she to which I said that I did not know as it happened in the blink of an eye and she was tossed down an embankment; an embankment that I crawled out of only to be greeted by an eye witness and soon after by the Highway Patrol and then the ambulance arrived. I shared that I looked down at her and she was near a tree however it was dark and the prospect of me climbing back down the hill simply was not to be. I went on to share that I had greater concern for the damage that would be caused during the extrication process; little did l know just how bad she was and in turn how lucky I was.

It was couple days later that I offered to openly share that which happened and it was deemed best to keep it between us and even more so out of respect for me he did not wish to open up Pandora’s box however with so many people now knowing of the accident IMO that moment has come and gone so it is time to allow folks to openly discuss it rather than have closet conversations and emails. I have spent nearly 5 years working with and assisting folks on this Forum sharing the good and the bad and IMO this is albeit an ugly one simply another moment in time; a moment that need not be tucked away.

For those of you that have communicated with me and shared your concern for my well being I thank you as it was a physically demanding moment in time and there continues to be an emotional weight carried that I would never wish on any one; if the accident had happened when I was in my gal it would be far easier for me to deal with.

Now I feel the need to openly share with Ray how sadden I am because it was while driving one of his gals that this happened.

So what happened?

Well I will share that the chain of events that lead up this moment in time are fundamental; I was called and asked by a friend aka Ray if I could take a look at his gal, this after she had been with another for several months to see if she was able to be made ready to be enjoyed at the Rally; without so much as a blink of an eye I said absolutely. Now IMO the stages for such a request were made when I assisted Ray with another of his gals a year earlier when we were in Texas so for me the fact that I was asked was rather cool. We never discussed a cost for me to do this at any point prior to her arrival or while she was with me because from my perspective I was simply a friend helping a friend at this point largely because I was very aware of that which he had gone through up that point. I remember chatting with Chip soon after she arrived during which he said; if there is anything that you can do to insure that Ray can have fun with his gal at the Rally it would be very cool because that past few years have had him at the Rally with gals that he could not drive to which I said that I planned to do everything in my power to make this happen.

Once she arrived I looked her over making her crisp as I was able to and sharing my opinions as requested with Ray however one of the lingering questions/concerns shared by Ray was her drivability. I told Ray that I would not drive her until I had a copy of her registration and the proof of insurance in my possession even though I had been told by him that “it’s alright to drive and she is fully insured; no worries”. Now for those that know me also know that I do not like to drive another’s gal and will never do so without copies of the registration and insurance as well as a statement allowing me to do so. Then when I do drive them it is late at night so as to have little or no traffic and as I am often referred to as a “little old lady”.

Once I had the documentation from Ray I let him know that I was going to take her for a drive; in fact I sent him a short video clip just before I left. Once on the road I stopped and filled her with a fresh load of fuel and then proceeded to drive her 30 ish miles during which I was monitoring her vacuum/boost signal as this was one of the concerns presented by Ray and with all appearing fine I then turned around and headed back. It was about 10 miles later that I stopped and opened her clamshell and did a visual inspection because in addition to the vacuum/boost issue there was a concern about clutch smell.

With everything looking fine I closed her up and proceeded back on the highway cruising in the slow lane between 60-65 mph and then approximately 3 miles later I am tossed off the highway and proceeded to (as described by the witness) to fly backwards through several tree tops as the drop off the highway was 60 plus feet and then she finally landed on all fours without the air bag deploying.

This particular section of the highway goes from asphalt to loose gravel approximately the width of a large truck and then immediately drops off into a ravine with no curbing or secondary medium to preclude this from happening whereas there are guard rails not long before and after this section. When I completed my crawl up to the highway I was asked by the witness; “what happened; did a tire blow” to which I said that I had no idea and then I was told that I commented/questioned several times how does one tell a friend that you just got in an accident with their gal. I simply could not believe that which had happened.

A few days later I went back to the accident scene and walked it during which one of the Highway Patrol officers on site that night stopped by and chatted with me. As it was when I arrived the Highway Patrol were on scene within a few hundred feet of the accident site extricating another car. He said first and foremost that he felt that I was very lucky and that because there was a witness emergency services were on the scene within a few minutes otherwise the accident could have gone unnoticed throughout the night and if I had been trapped in the gal it could have been devastating. I asked what his thoughts were and he said that he did not know as it appeared that a tire let lose or something mechanical failed this supported by the fact that the right rear tire was off the wheel. There was no citation issue because as he said; it was an accident and one that I was lucky to walk away from.

It was a couple days after the accident and Ray flew into town and went to see his gal and then came by to make sure that I was alright during which he shared pictures of his gal. When I saw the pictures of his gal I was in all but in tears because my recollection of that which happened versus what the pictures depicted were as if night and day; for example I initially told Ray that I simply opened the door and then crawled up the hill however the pictures show clearly that I was not able to open the driver side door but rather used the passenger door an act that to this day I do not remember.

Now when Ray visited me we discussed many things including what my insurance coverage was; specifically he asked if I had a “Garage Keepers” policy and having me contact my insurance company to have her/him taken care of. I told him that I did not have a “Garage Keepers” policy and I also said that I was not sure how it would get handled but that it would be worked out; Ray reminded me in a later conversation that I even went so far as to offer to help him on a personal level with other projects. It was during this conversation that I also made mention that depending on how this incident was presented to the public that it could cause harm to my reputation. In retrospect I think that I was hurting very bad, full of pain medication, still in a state of shock as such I was having a hard time coming to grips with that which had happened; then the fact that Ray was there with me with all of this compounded even more so after seeing the pictures so I likely rambled rather than thinking/communicating clearly; with clear mind I know that my reputation would never be affected by an act such as this because it was an accident and not a malicious act and yet I am beyond deeply saddened by this incident. We see accidents all the time never expecting it to us and even more so us when driving a friends gal.

Later that day I contacted my insurance company and a claim was opened and we also discussed and I requested a “Garage Keepers” policy or ? to protect one whether a friend or ? when I drive their car and was told that regardless in this particular case that the insurance company insuring the gal would need to be contacted and a claim opened then the claim would be subrogated through my insurance carrier; I was informed that vehicle insurance follows the vehicle and not the driver hence what they referred to as the permissive driver clause is in place which they said was consistent with my having Ray's permission and having the gal's current registration and proof of insurance in my possession before I drove her. I discussed this with Ray and his sweetie Janna after which the processes were initiated. Now there is no doubt that Ray was disappointed and likely frustrated that he had to do this and yet between us we felt that we were moving in the right direction and yet never an ill word was shared by Ray but rather only his concern that I was alright. Once Ray determined that the gal was likely totaled I then proceeded to look for a suitable replacement gal and shared this with him. Ultimately such a gal was located with Shelby.

Ray and his sweetie Janna have helped me work through this awkward situation with the support of their insurance agency. There remain a couple open issues however I remain confident that they too will be amicably resolved thus allowing this chapter in our lives to be closed.

Now having shared all of this during this process I was made aware by another person that baring an amicable resolve that within the Forum that this incident would likely be the “end of life” for the me aka the Shadowman. I listened to this and it was initially gut wrenching to hear because there was no malicious act, no inappropriate use of the gal, but rather a devastating accident that could have been much worse. Then when I consider my personal commitment to each and every person on this Forum I feel that the sharing of this accident is important. Regardless of the comments I will forever feel bad for Ray and for the loss of his gal and yet happy that I am still here and able to share with all to be careful because accidents do happen and sadly even under the most favorable of circumstances and without warning.

There is no doubt that this is my story so to some it will be considered as self serving but then I was the only one in the car with an unknown witness that stopped to assist supported by the Highway Patrol’s comments. I made certain that there was proper registration and insurance coverage before the drive commenced and then the unthinkable happened; for Ray and I this will forever be a less than stellar moment in time.

I expect comments and will do my best to answer any questions and yet more than questions and answers I simply want this story to be known so that folks can openly discuss it as I have nothing that I care to hide.

Takes care

Shadowman