tofu_house

iTrader: (2)

Hey guys,

I helped my mom pick up a new 2010 RX350 Truffle/Ivory yesterday and while I was speaking with the salesman, I brought up the IS-F.

He offered a IS-F, loaded, with all taxes included for $65k. I've also got my 2002 GS430 that I would be trading in for it.

Is this a decent price? I've been juggling the idea between an IS-F and an M3 for awhile now but haven't really had any opportunity to speak with a salesperson. Just happened to come up yesterday when I picked up the RX for my mom.

Could the IS-F be had for lower? Are there any members here that have experienced both the IS-F and the M3? Which car did you go with/prefer and why?

Any input would be appreciated. I'll definitely be looking at both cars for myself while I decide. May also look at the S5 while I'm at it. I would be looking at the M3 coupe and not the sedan. IS-F is obviously a 4-door only but that doesn't bother me.

The only real downside that I've heard about is the trouble of getting a staggered am wheel setup on the IS-F. Is this true?

BTW, the RX350 is awesome. Wasn't a fan of the looks (both exterior and interior) but it's growing on me... especially as I drive it. Haha

rominl

iTrader: (4)

65k out of the door? what's the msrp of the car? that sounds high. if msrp is 63k, invoice on the isf is what, something around 53k? that's the price i'd pay, plus tax and fees, that would come out to like 58k or so. i am playing from memory

between the isf and m3, they are pretty different cars, i suggest you drive them both and see what suits you best. imho m3 has better feedback and dynamics, i like the throttle more, quieter. but interior, audio systems, the isf is far better.

what trouble in getting staggered wheel setup for the isf? i don't see why that's a problem

in the end, i have the m3, so you know what my choice is. i did consider the isf very strongly

tofu_house

iTrader: (2)

Hmm, I remember reading a post by D2 awhile back trying to get a more aggressive staggered setup on Cathafer's IS-F but were having trouble getting a good clearance on the rear wheels. In the end, it wasn't as aggressive as they wanted it to be. Maybe I misunderstood something or perhaps the aggressive setup they were going for was REALLY aggressive. Not entirely clear...

Well, base MSRP is a little above $59k from what I've gathered on Lexus website. With the car loaded and including the taxes and other fees, he was talking $65k out the door. $58k is much lower than what I was expecting. If that's true, I'd love it.

I'll definitely take the time and look at both cars.

Is your M3 your DD? I've read that the low end torque on the F is considerably better than the M but in general, the M is the better performer. Not taking the performance aspect too much into play because the two cars are pretty close in that segment. But considering that this car will be my DD, I'm leaning towards the F. But man, I've always wanted to own an M car. Aren't the E9X series M cars the final generation of NA engines that BMW will offer? I heard that BMW is moving to FI for the next gen of M's.

Thanks for your help.

gengar

FWIW, I got nearly 5k off my F and I was a pretty early adopter. Without knowing the options and taxes, it's impossible to tell how much they're offering off MSRP. Personally, I would never pay a significant premium over invoice for any car on the lot.


Many M3 owners bemoan the lack of low-end torque, but having finally gotten a chance to drive the E90 M3, I'm honestly not sure what so many of them are complaining about. The way they talk about it you'd think it was an S2000 or something. Certainly the M3 has noticeably less torque than the F, but the car has plenty of low end torque for daily driving.

IMO, the F is a better car than the M3, period - but these are both very good compromise entry-level luxury-performance cars and there are many reasons to get either over the other. Getting the last naturally-aspirated M that we may see in our lifetimes is a very good reason.

PureDrifter

iTrader: (10)

note: Invoice on the IS-F (base) is ~$52.5k with MSRP of ~$58.5k

rdgdawg

Yep, more like it, usually $5K-$8K mark-up to MSRP

On what to buy: DRIVE BOTH!!!!

4TehNguyen

iTrader: (1)

buy a used one

Joeb427

iTrader: (1)

Go with an M3.

If you want that IS-F,go around $57K out the door on that car.The '11's are out soon.

mikefate

i bought used
08 isf that was very clean. $38k, which included taxes, title, etc etc.

it was a cadillac dealer and they didnt want the car there(foreign). they sai dit looked bad for business. they had it listed for $44k on internet and $42k at dealer on window. i ended up walking out with it same day.

mmarshall

The average IS-F (which I assume you are loooking at) lists in the low 60s, so 65K out the door after taxes, tags, etc.....is probably in the ballpark. Given the choice between the M3 and IS-F, I'd probably go with the Lexus simply based on reliability issues alone. But before you sign for an IS-F, check it out (with proper tire pressures) on a rough road, and make sure you can tolerate the ride. This car has a VERY stiff suspension by sedan standards, particularly the rear suspension, and it slams and tosses the rear end of the car up and down on sharp bumps and frost heaves. The M3 is a little better, but still on the stiff side.

Faraaz23

Is this a 2010 IS-F? You may want to wait until the 2011 model comes to the showrooms. Lexus has revised the steering and suspension for 2011. From what I remember reading, it wont be quite as punishing of a ride. The new steering supposedly is going to improve responsiveness.

rominl

iTrader: (4)

now i see what you mean. yes, in terms of wheel fitment, the isf is very very conservative, it's nothing like m3 at all, so you can't put very aggressive setup on the isf. but if you just want normal staggered setup on the isf that's no problem at all

on the price, who pays msrp on the isf now. from what i know the car has been sold at close to invoice for a long time. personally i wouldn't pay more than 500 or at most 1000 over invoice at this time. 2011 is coming, and also the isf just isn't selling that hot. i always see inventory at dealerships i go to. if the car you look at has 59k msrp, 65k out of the door, that sales is smoking something good

yes, my m3 (convertible) is my daily driver, and it's 6mt too. i have zero problem driving the car in and out, it's super easy to drive.

regarding the tq, to be honest, it's either for people who look at papers and start crying, or those who have no idea how to drive the car. on paper it ONLY has 270tq, but in real life, i created a thread before, on dyno the car produces more tq than vette in the first 2 gears i think. some people drive the car and shift up to 3rd or 4th like no tomorrow, yeah of course that will suffer. i normally don't shift until it's 3500rpm or above, and i have never run into problem of low tq. it has a high rev engine so you have to drive it differently

but yes, i strongly recommend you to drive both cars to see which one you like more. no car is "better", it's just which one fits you more. for me, when i get a car like this, i don't care much about luxury or good audio / nav system, i want steering, road feel, that push, and the m3 fits the bill perfectly. but some people want to keep the car for long and they want to be able to cruise like normal, the isf is better

btw, i lease my m3. i don't plan to keep this car for long anyway. so that might affect your decision.

and yes, this is the last generation of m3 with NA engine. next will be turbo v6, and likely no more high rev. i just love the NA setup with high rev redline

Fizzboy7

Never buy a car with the "out the door" thing in mind. You'd be missing out on several ways to save money. You have to work with the invoice and go up or down from there. Dealers make tons of extra money doing the "out the door" thing.

I8ABMR

65k??? They arent doing you any favors.

Lets Drive

iTrader: (3)

Agreed, the deals are certainly out there, and I wouldn't be moving too far from invoice, at most, on the cars. I managed to get mine below invoice, and that didn't include other bits which sweetened the deal, such as free maintenance and such (thanks BMW).

Tofu, when you say 'loaded', which options are you speaking of exactly? That word has long become a misnomer, as most people who claim to have loaded cars are typically missing options, which makes determining a good deal that much more tricky. Also, as others have stated, OTD pricing by itself doesn't say much, without understanding the breakdown of where you payed what.