GX 460 4/19 VSC recall (Consumer Reports "don't buy" label lifted 5/7)
04-13-10, 10:56 PM
#106
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
We believe that in real-world driving, that situation could lead to a rollover accident, which could cause serious injury or death. We are not aware, however, of any such reports.
04-13-10, 10:57 PM
#107
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And we're all stunned by your response - lol!
And if you don't think that commercial was a bit irresponsible (as would any manufacturer who touts the emergency handling capabilities of a BOF SUV), then you have a thinner skin w/ regard to Toyota/Lexus criticism than even most Toyota/Lexus "homers."
And if you don't think that commercial was a bit irresponsible (as would any manufacturer who touts the emergency handling capabilities of a BOF SUV), then you have a thinner skin w/ regard to Toyota/Lexus criticism than even most Toyota/Lexus "homers."
04-13-10, 11:32 PM
#109
Lexus Test Driver
The worst part about this entire thing is how the news media is reporting it and how the average Joe is going to perceive it. The report I heard on ABC tonight validated that. The news did nothing to talk about the slide or stability control. They just showed the video and said the vehicle is being recalled for rolling over. I garantee you, 85-90% of the general public now thinks this SUV rolls over- which it does not. This is how our society works and feeds now- ratings, money, hype, bad-mouthing and gossip. I think it all started with reality shows and watching people fail in them. Now we have to make outselves feel better by watching others (Toyota/Lexus) fail. It's the new American way.
04-13-10, 11:37 PM
#110
The worst part about this entire thing is how the news media is reporting it and how the average Joe is going to perceive it. The report I heard on ABC tonight validated that. The news did nothing to talk about the slide or stability control. They just showed the video and said the vehicle is being recalled for rolling over. I garantee you, 85-90% of the general public now thinks this SUV rolls over- which it does not. This is how our society works and feeds now- ratings, money, hype, bad-mouthing and gossip. I think it all started with reality shows and watching people fail in them. Now we have to make outselves feel better by watching others (Toyota/Lexus) fail. It's the new American way.
and to be fair, they actually interviewed people from edmunds, which commented that this is a relatively small incident right now, and not likely to affect toyota/lexus sales significantly. they also commented that people should not panic, the car is still very much safe to drive, just need more (common) senses and pay closer attention until lexus come out with solution.
they also posted a note from lexus saying that their engineers are actively studying the car together with the specific test parameters from CR so they can further improve the GX's performance
i think they reported it very well and probably the best for toyota too
04-13-10, 11:40 PM
#111
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watch the video again and see how the pro driver corrected the car in the middle when the rear was swinging out. he countered the oversteer by turning the wheel to the left. that's what saved the car.
if it's normal people driving, in oversteering condition, they don't counter the steering and the car WILL flip for sure
that's the difference. this video shows the potential problem -- without the unfortunate ending
a lot of people completely missed the point of this study and report. it's not about driving smart or stupid, that's a completely different topic. but this is about safety and "unforeseen" condition....
it's basically saying if everyone drives smart and right, then there is absolutely zero need for stability control, airbags, bumper crush bars, reinforced structures and protections, etc... coz' there won't be any accidents right?
the point of all these is to have computers to help take control of the car and avoid potential problems. and in this case (at least according to CR), the gx is not living up to expectations
yes, i agree, their quick and decisive response this time is probably one of the best i have seen in recent time by toyota. better safe than sorry, better be conservative. hold off everything and study / understand further, implement necessary fixes if applicable, and then come clean.
toyota was already in trouble with their recent problems left and right, and the report from CR this morning would not help them in anyway. instead of having other random people or presses put further damages, toyota now basically stops everything.
if anything, this is more like a ecu fix, and that's very much programmable which is a great thing
this probably will cause toyota the least damages in the long run regarding this issue
if it's normal people driving, in oversteering condition, they don't counter the steering and the car WILL flip for sure
that's the difference. this video shows the potential problem -- without the unfortunate ending
a lot of people completely missed the point of this study and report. it's not about driving smart or stupid, that's a completely different topic. but this is about safety and "unforeseen" condition....
it's basically saying if everyone drives smart and right, then there is absolutely zero need for stability control, airbags, bumper crush bars, reinforced structures and protections, etc... coz' there won't be any accidents right?
the point of all these is to have computers to help take control of the car and avoid potential problems. and in this case (at least according to CR), the gx is not living up to expectations
yes, i agree, their quick and decisive response this time is probably one of the best i have seen in recent time by toyota. better safe than sorry, better be conservative. hold off everything and study / understand further, implement necessary fixes if applicable, and then come clean.
toyota was already in trouble with their recent problems left and right, and the report from CR this morning would not help them in anyway. instead of having other random people or presses put further damages, toyota now basically stops everything.
if anything, this is more like a ecu fix, and that's very much programmable which is a great thing
this probably will cause toyota the least damages in the long run regarding this issue
Regardless of sensationalism, skill of a driver, or what to do in that situation, Toyota for it's own sake needs to fix this quickly, and move on.
Plus, emergency situations are called that for a reason. You don't expect or anticipate an emergency.
Big respect to Lexus for putting a notice up on the US website already in such quick fashion, and making sure Lexus owners and buyers know that loaners are being provided to anyone who has a GX 460 and is worried about it.
Now that's customer service.
Toyota seems to be acting much faster now and this I think will minimize or prevent future media witch hunts against Toyota.
04-13-10, 11:45 PM
#112
Lexus Test Driver
funny, i just watched the abc news at 11 here in socal, and it's pretty different. it explained pretty clearly that CR conducted the study and that the car is more likely to have roll over due to stability control (while showing the video)
and to be fair, they actually interviewed people from edmunds, which commented that this is a relatively small incident right now, and not likely to affect toyota/lexus sales significantly. they also commented that people should not panic, the car is still very much safe to drive, just need more (common) senses and pay closer attention until lexus come out with solution.
they also posted a note from lexus saying that their engineers are actively studying the car together with the specific test parameters from CR so they can further improve the GX's performance
i think they reported it very well and probably the best for toyota too
and to be fair, they actually interviewed people from edmunds, which commented that this is a relatively small incident right now, and not likely to affect toyota/lexus sales significantly. they also commented that people should not panic, the car is still very much safe to drive, just need more (common) senses and pay closer attention until lexus come out with solution.
they also posted a note from lexus saying that their engineers are actively studying the car together with the specific test parameters from CR so they can further improve the GX's performance
i think they reported it very well and probably the best for toyota too
04-14-10, 12:08 AM
#113
I found the report lacking, like most have so far on the news. The video of the power slide is being shown when they are saying the car rolls over. Another clips states the same thing while showing the GX comfortably going around a corner. That doesn't mesh and is confusing to the average non-car person. And bare in mind half the people watching the news have it on in the background and are doing other things, not paying full attention. All they are going to hear is "...Lexus recalled for roll over." Again, I garantee you the majority of people (non-car enthusiasts) hearing these reports are going to panic, get the wrong idea, and this entire thing will get blown out of proportion again. Our society, with the help of the media, wants the hype, wants the choas, and wants the failure.
and in that sense, again, back to lexus and i think they have done the very best
04-14-10, 12:16 AM
#114
Lexus Test Driver
You are right. Lexus can only do what it has to do to get through this mess. I think stopping sales was a bold and brave move. Hopefully the ECU's can be reprogrammed and this put behind us. I don't want anything messing with my IS resale value. ; )
04-14-10, 12:41 AM
#116
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This is why I bought my GX460 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9BiZ...eature=related
I didn't buy it for a formula Drift event, Consumer Reports is full of crap, hopefully Toyota sues them like Suzuki did!
I didn't buy it for a formula Drift event, Consumer Reports is full of crap, hopefully Toyota sues them like Suzuki did!
04-14-10, 01:04 AM
#117
Dysfunctional Veteran
Slam your foot down on the gas (in a safe are of course, doesnt take very long to feel the effects), then LET GO as quickly as you stomped on the gas and dont hit the brakes. You will hear the "kachunk" as soon as you lift off the gas. The noise you will hear is the Universal joints in the driveshaft coping with the sudden halt of torque output from the transmission.
Its the transmission "backwinding" (a.k.a. engine braking) that is the issue here. In Lexus' case, I would be inclined to believe a simple TCM (trans control module) reflash would be needed to change a few things. Or an ECU (Engine control unit) reflash to adjust the DBW system.
I doubt VERY seriously (given toyota/lexus' track record over the last 20 years) that it is ANYWHERE near as serious as CR made it out to be.
The Problem is more likely related to HOW they were driving the SUV in the first place. It isnt a sports car, it is a SPORT UTILITY VEHICLE...and as such should be driven like one...with extreme caution and the utmost care.
[/end rant]
04-14-10, 01:28 AM
#118
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
Toyota made the VSC react the way it does on the GX460 for "off-roading purposes." Your bound to loose traction on loose gravel, mud, snow, sand, rocks, etc. Do you really want VSC intruding on your off-roading adventure, the Land Cruiser prados have the same ECu structure!
