J.P.

Do not want to take it off topic more but always been a Ford Truck fan, would have liked a F-150 this time around but the GM was just too cheap.

Next time for towing I will prob go F-250 as my discount wont help anymore on GM.

Anyways, good debate, back on topic we go

mmarshall

No. This is only partly correct. I have driven both cars. Neither ride is harsh by any means, but both cars are noticeably firmer-riding than their predecessors.

This is also at least partly incorrect. The Buick, at least to the seat of my pants, is not firmer than the Lexus. The Buick is definitely more steering-responsive (quite a bit more), but that seems to be more because of the way the steering rack is geared, rather than any real differences between the two suspensions. In my experience, there is little if any real difference in the ride quality.......both are a reasonable balance between cushiness and firmness.


Nope......with the interior trim improvements over the 2007-2009 models, the Lexus wins for 2010. The new LaCrosse does have a swoop, futuristic-looking interior (and there is some material quality improvement), but much of it is the same old GM plastic with new shapes and styles.


Yes, the ES has been virtually bulletproof except for some transmission ECU issues and dash rattles. But Buick has clearly been above average too, with most of its products.


Both deserve a test. Each one has unique features to offer. A BIG plus for the Buick, though, is the AWD option on the 3.0L CXL model. This is something that the ES has needed for years, and that Lexus has dragged their feet on.

LexBob2

In general, the LaCrosse and ES350 will be cross shopped, and purchased, by older conservative buyers. The competiton is good and will benefit the consumer. It will also keep each brand on their toes. A win-win situation.

mmarshall

The whole idea for the new LaCrosse, though, was to try and increase its appeal to younger, LESS-conservative buyers. So far, it appears to have had some sucess in that regard (certainly with the automotive press)......but it is still brand-new on the market, and time will tell.

LexBob2

I wonder if/when Buick will expand comparisons to other models to reach that younger less conservative audience. So far, it's been focused only on the ES.

IS-SV

The article in Autoweek in September sheds some light on Buick's goals and shows they are somewhat realistic with expectations and not just blowing smoke as usual:

Buick officials have said they think the LaCrosse's blend of style, content and value will put the car on the consideration list of intenders for import entry-luxury sedans such as the Lexus ES 350 and Acura TL.

"Some of our targets are aspirational," said Craig Bierley, Buick product marketing director, in an AutoObserver interivew. "It's going to take time and effort in order for us to be seen by consumers in that space. We have to earn our way."

Edmunds also reported that domestic models were mostly cross-shopped by "new" LaCrosse buyers in the early months, despite Buick's efforts to compare to imports mentioned.

IS-SV

Per Automotive News in December, this is what the new head of Buick-GMC is saying, (realizing it's all just talk at this point):

Buick-GMC's new chief inherits a familiar challenge: change consumers' perception of the Buick brand.

"Buick's an older person's vehicle," says Brian Sweeney, describing the public's view. "What can we do to reverse that?"

Sweeney, a 42-year-old sales and marketing executive at General Motors Co., became general manager of Buick-GMC on Dec. 17.

GMC, Sweeney says, is in good shape. Attracting a younger Buick clientele poses his greatest challenge.

To be clear, "younger" doesn't mean people in their 20s, says Craig Bierley, Buick's product marketing director. Younger, he says, means people in their 40s and 50s.

While the average age of a U.S. car buyer is 52, the average age of a buyer of a Buick sedan is 70, Bierley says.

That is changing. More than a third of the buyers of the 2010 LaCrosse are 55 or younger, Bierley says, up from fewer than than 10 percent of the previous version's purchasers.

Part of Buick's strategy is to create vehicles with better performance and technology. Sweeney is counting on the Regal sedan -- a reworked Opel Insignia coming in the spring.

The other part of the strategy is showing Buick to consumers. Much of the Regal's advertising will be "experiential marketing," Bierley says. Buick started with the 2010 LaCrosse, taking the car to coffee shops, art fairs and wine festivals.

Sweeney is the third head of Buick-GMC in a month. He replaces Michael Richards, a former Ford Motor Co. executive who spent eight days at GM. Before Richards, Susan Docherty, now GM's U.S. sales and marketing boss, led the brands since June 2008.

GS69

So I was just now driving & saw a car a bit ahead of me & I assumed that it was a BMW based upon the tail lights. When I got closer, it was a new LaCrosse. Must say that it is not that bad looking a car; definitely more luxurious looking than previous Buicks ... and for the record, it was an elderly couple in it. Well over 60 years old from what I could tell.

LexBob2

This and the Autoweek article are interesting. It sounds like Buick is being realistic about this new model and not just the normal brand speak.

A lot of turnover at Buick-GMC. Seems like they need to establish some consistency at the top.

Joeb427

iTrader: (1)

Buick's problem.

mmarshall

Buick's Enclave, of course, was also an attempt to reach non-traditional Buick buyers, but I suspect that the reason it has not been directly compared to any Lexus models is that Lexus does not market an SUV that is directly competitive with the Enclave. The Lexus RX is smaller than the Enclave, lacking a third-row seat, and the GX and LX are both (more or less) truck-based and designed more for off-roading.

mmarshall

I hope that aged couple doesn't end up with Buyers' Remorse (although GM does have a money-back policy now for a limited period). Although the new LaCrosse does (now) have an excellent ride-handling balance, the ride is definitely not as purely comfort-based (some would say mushy) as the previous-generation was. So, if they thought they were buying a classic Buick mush-mobile, they may (?) be disappointed. And those who are used to the slow, sluggish steering response of the old LaCrosse will find the new one almost race-car-like (in comparison), with its much faster response.

I have to admit that when I reviewed the new 2010 3.0L LaCrosse CXL, I was simply astonished at its road manners. With the new chassis/tires, I expected a loss of ride comfort (and, yes, there was some loss, but not that much), but the huge improvement in handling and steering response more than made up for it. And the smooth, quiet Buick transmission/powertrain remains....now with an AWD option.

IS-SV

Wow, now you are finally understanding what successful premium cars and sophisticated suspension systems with modern tires must deliver in 2009.

The solution isn't SUV/pickup truck tires with 75 series profiles and surging overly soft vomit-inducing suspension that loses control at higher speeds and uses all it's suspension travel in a dangerous way. The solution is advanced suspension systems, advancements in suspension isolation, super-stiff unibody construction, advanced tires that can give a decent ride in large diameter/low-profile sizes.

Because the goal today is a high level of control combined with a comfortable ride and it's expected with premium cars especially (and it's a big active safety factor too).

mmarshall

Not really. After years of test-driving/sampling BMW and Mercedes products, I know what good ride/steering/handling combinations are....I'm no stranger to that. But, yes, I do like a smooth, traditional luxury-car ride, like on the luxury cars you and I grew up with....I'd be lying to you if I said I didn't. Those days, of course, are pretty much gone.

A mush-mobile chassis works OK on smooth roads and lower speeds, but I agree with you that they are unsuitable for rough roads, sharp winding curves, or Autobahn-type speeds. But rough roads can damage the low-profile tires and wheels on newer designs.



Stiff body structures, of course, allow the suspension to do its job without any additional deforming from lateral or longitudional body flex.

IS-SV

Yes really, I think you do get it. Remember that I am old enough to remember driving those poor-handling "smooth, traditional luxury-car ride" kind of geezer pleazer cars too.

The differences are (2):

1. Many of use not only test drive and sample BMW/Lexus/Audi/Jag/Mercedes-type cars, we actually own and drive then for tens of thousands of miles, but agreed we all know what the best of ride/handling combos feel like.

2. Many of us live in huge Western states where high speeds in uncongested areas on mediocre maintained roads are the norm so we appreciate safe/secure/controlled/comfortable ride at speed because it's both a safety factor and a comfort factor (comfort and control is important to reduce driver fatigue). When traveling across vast expanses in the Western states autobahn capabilities are important for both safety and comfort.