Mercedes S 400 Hybrid

[rominl]

Originally Posted by dunnojack

lexus NMH batteries won't last as long. unless you plan to get rid of the car after a few years, then it wouldn't matter

i always wonder though, what's "not as long"? like how many yrs? that's always my question when i think about hybrid. i don't read a lot about old prius having battery problems and they have been around for yrs, would that apply to other toyota/lexus hybrid too?

[SLegacy99]

Originally Posted by dunnojack

lexus NMH batteries won't last as long. unless you plan to get rid of the car after a few years, then it wouldn't matter

What are you talking about? Nimh batteries hybrids are kept between 40 and 60% charge, thus they can rack up well over 200,000 miles. 12 years later, Priui with their original batteries are still on the road. This is the downside of Li-ion technology. These batteries can store more energy, but are only expected to last 7 years. The upside is that they are still worth some money even when their storing power is depleted.

[MPLexus301]

Originally Posted by dunnojack

lexus NMH batteries won't last as long. unless you plan to get rid of the car after a few years, then it wouldn't matter

Won't last as long as Li-Ion? There are still plenty of ten year old Priuses running around that have had no major powertrain problems after hundreds of thousands of miles of use. Li-Ion is relatively new and somewhat unproven for use in automobiles.

Do you know something I don't

[4TehNguyen]

toyota gives you a 10 year warranty on hybrid components

[SLegacy99]

Originally Posted by rominl

i always wonder though, what's "not as long"? like how many yrs? that's always my question when i think about hybrid. i don't read a lot about old prius having battery problems and they have been around for yrs, would that apply to other toyota/lexus hybrid too?

Here you go:

For almost five years, I have operated three Toyota Priuses as a Yellow Cab--with no failures. The first Prius, a 2001 model, was put on the road Nov. 1, 2000, and acquired 200,000 miles in 25 months. The components that did wear out were not hybrid related components. The current 2004 Prius that is on as a Yellow Cab in Vancouver B.C. Canada just passed 240,000 miles and still no major repairs.

http://www.greentaxi.org/testimonials.php


Toyota/Lexus wouldn't be racing to put out hybrids, equipped with 8 year, 100,000 mile warranties on their hybrid components if the batteries were going to fail. That would mean money loss for Toyota.

[1SICKLEX]

I was expecting a lot higher ratings. Still its a first effort so its a learning experience and kudos to Benz for offering it!

[rogers2]

[quote= Mercedes = Honda of Germany.[/QUOTE]

Please!! What a ridiculous statement. The truth is that Mercedes don't really care about making a hybrid. I think they only made this car to show that could make a hybrid. I remember one of Mercedes leading engineers saying that they could have offer more efficient cars years ago. But the guys of top said they didn't care about making more efficient car so every idea was trash.

[SLegacy99]

The 3800 Lb. E350 (so same V6) is rated for 18/26. So the slightly heavier S class, only having 1 MPG city (With Li-Ion bats mind you) is incredibly poor. MB could have direct injected the 3.5L V6, put it in the S class, and gotten the same result.

How does the Malibu hybrid with Ni-Mh bats gain 3 MPG and this does almost nothing?

Originally Posted by rogers2

Please!! What a ridiculous statement. The truth is that Mercedes don't really care about making a hybrid. I think they only made this car to show that could make a hybrid. I remember one of Mercedes leading engineers saying that they could have offer more efficient cars years ago. But the guys of top said they didn't care about making more efficient car so every idea was trash.

Have you heard of the CAFE standards? You know, the ones that all the automakers have to adhere to. MB has to build more efficient cars unless they want to jack up the price on all of their vehicles in order to pay the fines for not meeting the standards. Do your homework.

More Benz Hybrids On The Way
The S400 BlueHybrid is far from the only Benz hybrid, however. The company is expected to release a “full hybrid’ version of its US-built ML sport utility that uses the Two-Mode Hybrid system, co-developed with GM, Chrysler, and BMW, by the end of this year as well. This will make the ML one of very few vehicles in the world offered with gasoline, hybrid, and diesel powertrains, since Benz introduced the 50-state ML320 Bluetec late last year.

http://www.hybridcars.com/vehicle/me...00-hybrid.html

[1SICKLEX]

When you see the ratings for this car and the Insight, you really gain an appreciation for Toyota/Lexus hybrids. One cannot simply wake up one morning and make/sell one.

Ford seems to have figured out a good method as well in their Fusion.

[nthach]

Originally Posted by SLegacy99

Mercedes = Honda of Germany.

Isn't that VW?

And the Benz is a mild hybrid too - not a full hybrid like the LSh. Toyota and Ford have good track records on their hybrid systems, Honda and GM don't.

[dunnojack]

Originally Posted by SLegacy99

Here you go:



http://www.greentaxi.org/testimonials.php


Toyota/Lexus wouldn't be racing to put out hybrids, equipped with 8 year, 100,000 mile warranties on their hybrid components if the batteries were going to fail. That would mean money loss for Toyota.

sure, they won't break down. there's a motor to back it up.

but can the nimh hold its charge as well after that many miles......is the question....

[MR_F1]

Just simply weak.

[DustinV]

How did they drive the car? That is my question. I personally don't trust the EPA and their constant varying MPG scores for a number of automobiles. There are simply to many variables which affect the overall outcome. Driver A and driver B will never get the same fuel economy with the same car due to their different driving styles and the conditions they drove under. I feel that this is often left out of the equation.

Also, on a number of other news boards I've seen the words "predicted fuel economy" along with this article. Does this mean these are simply predicted fuel economy ratings with no real basis? Was the car broken in properly yet (at least the V6 engine)?

Incidentally, the car magazine I subscribe to had a first drive with the S400 Hybrid and they achieved an impressive 8.4 liters per 100 km during this first drive. This translates into almost 27.9 mpg. I would wait until more car magazines test the car before commenting on the EPA "predicted" fuel economy.

Here's the PDF I downloaded from their site (changed into JPEG format so I could upload it quicker).

[GFerg]

Not that impressed. Hopefully it will be priced aggressively.

[SLegacy99]

Originally Posted by dunnojack

sure, they won't break down. there's a motor to back it up.

but can the nimh hold its charge as well after that many miles......is the question....

Read the article. Had the battery not been able to hold a charge, the ICE would have to run constantly to power the vehicle and attempt to power the battery to run the electric motors. Fuel economy would plummet. Spoiler: the batteries last!