You've made the grade, Hyundai...now DON'T blow it.
06-25-05, 10:52 AM
#1
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
You've made the grade, Hyundai...now DON'T blow it.
Those of you at CL who follow the auto industry, My posts, and Mike's (1SICKLEX) posts will know just what I am talking about...the transfer of Sonata production from Korea to Alabama.
Hyundai (and Kia's) rise in just 5-10-years from having some of the worst quality in the industry to some of the best has been nothing short of astronomical. Mike and I have both talked about it at length, and I won't re-hash all the details here, but nowhere has the rise been more pronounced than in the Sonata, although I myself have been even more impressed with the Accent's improvements.....especially for its $10,000 price tag.
I the early 1990's the Sonata, quality and reliability-wise, was the worst mid-sized car in Consumer Reports database. Today it is one of the best. Similiar results have been shown at J.D Power. But....that quality has been acheived in Korean plants, with Korean workers. It may or may not be able to continue at that high level at an Alabama plant....only time will tell.
Now...there is nothing inherently wrong with either American plants or American workers...and I do not mean to suggest otherwise. Toyota, Honda, Mazda, Nissan, and Geo/Chevy/Toyota have for years built A-1 quality cars in plants at Georgetown, KY, Marysville, OH, Flat Rock, MI, Smyrna, TN, and Fremont, CA.
But, for whatever reasons, the results at the more recent new American auto plants by foreign automakers have not been encouraging....and not just initial teething problems but long-term results as well. BMW, when it opened its Spartanburg, SC plant for the Z-roadsters; Mercedes with the Tuscaloosa, AL plant for the M-Class, Nissan wth the Canton, MS plant for trucks and SUV's....all of these plants have had continuing quality problems, though Nissan seems to be starting to address the ones at Canton.
Now...I'm not saying that Hyundai should not open a U.S. plant..........Alabama, even with the Mercedes plant, is traditionally a low-income state and certainly could use some more well-paying jobs and the taxes those jobs and property will pay, but Hyundai's managers and employees have worked LONG and HARD over the years to drastically improve their vehicles and still offer low bargain prices and super-long warranties, and all I'm saying is that I hope they don't blow it just for the sake of being able to build the cars much closer to where they are are sold, without having to ship them across the Pacific. If the Alabama plant can turn out well-made Sonatas (hopefully better than the poorly-made Mercedes M-Class at Tuscaloosa), more power to them. If not, Hyundai should have a stand-by system in place to move production back to Korea.
Hyundai (and Kia's) rise in just 5-10-years from having some of the worst quality in the industry to some of the best has been nothing short of astronomical. Mike and I have both talked about it at length, and I won't re-hash all the details here, but nowhere has the rise been more pronounced than in the Sonata, although I myself have been even more impressed with the Accent's improvements.....especially for its $10,000 price tag.
I the early 1990's the Sonata, quality and reliability-wise, was the worst mid-sized car in Consumer Reports database. Today it is one of the best. Similiar results have been shown at J.D Power. But....that quality has been acheived in Korean plants, with Korean workers. It may or may not be able to continue at that high level at an Alabama plant....only time will tell.
Now...there is nothing inherently wrong with either American plants or American workers...and I do not mean to suggest otherwise. Toyota, Honda, Mazda, Nissan, and Geo/Chevy/Toyota have for years built A-1 quality cars in plants at Georgetown, KY, Marysville, OH, Flat Rock, MI, Smyrna, TN, and Fremont, CA.
But, for whatever reasons, the results at the more recent new American auto plants by foreign automakers have not been encouraging....and not just initial teething problems but long-term results as well. BMW, when it opened its Spartanburg, SC plant for the Z-roadsters; Mercedes with the Tuscaloosa, AL plant for the M-Class, Nissan wth the Canton, MS plant for trucks and SUV's....all of these plants have had continuing quality problems, though Nissan seems to be starting to address the ones at Canton.
Now...I'm not saying that Hyundai should not open a U.S. plant..........Alabama, even with the Mercedes plant, is traditionally a low-income state and certainly could use some more well-paying jobs and the taxes those jobs and property will pay, but Hyundai's managers and employees have worked LONG and HARD over the years to drastically improve their vehicles and still offer low bargain prices and super-long warranties, and all I'm saying is that I hope they don't blow it just for the sake of being able to build the cars much closer to where they are are sold, without having to ship them across the Pacific. If the Alabama plant can turn out well-made Sonatas (hopefully better than the poorly-made Mercedes M-Class at Tuscaloosa), more power to them. If not, Hyundai should have a stand-by system in place to move production back to Korea.
Last edited by mmarshall; 06-25-05 at 10:58 AM.
06-25-05, 05:19 PM
#2
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Originally Posted by mmarshall
Those of you at CL who follow the auto industry, My posts, and Mike's (1SICKLEX) posts will know just what I am talking about...the transfer of Sonata production from Korea to Alabama.
Hyundai (and Kia's) rise in just 5-10-years from having some of the worst quality in the industry to some of the best has been nothing short of astronomical. Mike and I have both talked about it at length, and I won't re-hash all the details here, but nowhere has the rise been more pronounced than in the Sonata, although I myself have been even more impressed with the Accent's improvements.....especially for its $10,000 price tag.
I the early 1990's the Sonata, quality and reliability-wise, was the worst mid-sized car in Consumer Reports database. Today it is one of the best. Similiar results have been shown at J.D Power. But....that quality has been acheived in Korean plants, with Korean workers. It may or may not be able to continue at that high level at an Alabama plant....only time will tell.
Now...there is nothing inherently wrong with either American plants or American workers...and I do not mean to suggest otherwise. Toyota, Honda, Mazda, Nissan, and Geo/Chevy/Toyota have for years built A-1 quality cars in plants at Georgetown, KY, Marysville, OH, Flat Rock, MI, Smyrna, TN, and Fremont, CA.
But, for whatever reasons, the results at the more recent new American auto plants by foreign automakers have not been encouraging....and not just initial teething problems but long-term results as well. BMW, when it opened its Spartanburg, SC plant for the Z-roadsters; Mercedes with the Tuscaloosa, AL plant for the M-Class, Nissan wth the Canton, MS plant for trucks and SUV's....all of these plants have had continuing quality problems, though Nissan seems to be starting to address the ones at Canton.
Now...I'm not saying that Hyundai should not open a U.S. plant..........Alabama, even with the Mercedes plant, is traditionally a low-income state and certainly could use some more well-paying jobs and the taxes those jobs and property will pay, but Hyundai's managers and employees have worked LONG and HARD over the years to drastically improve their vehicles and still offer low bargain prices and super-long warranties, and all I'm saying is that I hope they don't blow it just for the sake of being able to build the cars much closer to where they are are sold, without having to ship them across the Pacific. If the Alabama plant can turn out well-made Sonatas (hopefully better than the poorly-made Mercedes M-Class at Tuscaloosa), more power to them. If not, Hyundai should have a stand-by system in place to move production back to Korea.
Hyundai (and Kia's) rise in just 5-10-years from having some of the worst quality in the industry to some of the best has been nothing short of astronomical. Mike and I have both talked about it at length, and I won't re-hash all the details here, but nowhere has the rise been more pronounced than in the Sonata, although I myself have been even more impressed with the Accent's improvements.....especially for its $10,000 price tag.
I the early 1990's the Sonata, quality and reliability-wise, was the worst mid-sized car in Consumer Reports database. Today it is one of the best. Similiar results have been shown at J.D Power. But....that quality has been acheived in Korean plants, with Korean workers. It may or may not be able to continue at that high level at an Alabama plant....only time will tell.
Now...there is nothing inherently wrong with either American plants or American workers...and I do not mean to suggest otherwise. Toyota, Honda, Mazda, Nissan, and Geo/Chevy/Toyota have for years built A-1 quality cars in plants at Georgetown, KY, Marysville, OH, Flat Rock, MI, Smyrna, TN, and Fremont, CA.
But, for whatever reasons, the results at the more recent new American auto plants by foreign automakers have not been encouraging....and not just initial teething problems but long-term results as well. BMW, when it opened its Spartanburg, SC plant for the Z-roadsters; Mercedes with the Tuscaloosa, AL plant for the M-Class, Nissan wth the Canton, MS plant for trucks and SUV's....all of these plants have had continuing quality problems, though Nissan seems to be starting to address the ones at Canton.
Now...I'm not saying that Hyundai should not open a U.S. plant..........Alabama, even with the Mercedes plant, is traditionally a low-income state and certainly could use some more well-paying jobs and the taxes those jobs and property will pay, but Hyundai's managers and employees have worked LONG and HARD over the years to drastically improve their vehicles and still offer low bargain prices and super-long warranties, and all I'm saying is that I hope they don't blow it just for the sake of being able to build the cars much closer to where they are are sold, without having to ship them across the Pacific. If the Alabama plant can turn out well-made Sonatas (hopefully better than the poorly-made Mercedes M-Class at Tuscaloosa), more power to them. If not, Hyundai should have a stand-by system in place to move production back to Korea.
Wow, great point. I never thought about this, the move to America is a huge investment but as you have stated, outside Toyota/Honda, when companies have moved production here recently, the cars/SUVs quality has been sub-par.
If they get it right, Hyundai will be an even more serious force to deal with. But if they get it wrong, they will get hurt profit wise, since they have the 10/100,000 warrenty. And it will only take 1 CAR to bring all the jokes and bad press/image back.
06-25-05, 07:30 PM
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Oh I know playa, if it aint on twankies with A/C'd seats, it aint ***** haha
Uh okay....whatever that meant "playa".
Hyundais are offered at a good price and the warranties are very good, but I certainly do not think the cars they have offered lately have changed the Hyundai stigma. They have copied about every luxury automaker's style exteriorwise which cheapens it IMHO.
06-25-05, 08:41 PM
#6
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by mjr24
Hyundais are offered at a good price and the warranties are very good, but I certainly do not think the cars they have offered lately have changed the Hyundai stigma. .
06-25-05, 09:35 PM
#7
Lexus Test Driver
Hyundai was very concerned with quality loss by moving their manufacturing facilities from korea to america.
physically, it can be challenging for american workers to do the same level of work korean workers can do--not because of strength or intelligence--but because americans have larger hands. asians are genetically smaller and more nimble with their hands. best example of this is the fact that koreans can pick up a single grain of rice with metallic chopsticks no thicker than a twig....
due to this "physical" limitation, training the new workers at the alabama plant has been EXTENSIVE. Hyundai engineers knew of the potential loss in quality--and they've done their best to plug this potential leak.
we'll see how the new sonata is and find out!
physically, it can be challenging for american workers to do the same level of work korean workers can do--not because of strength or intelligence--but because americans have larger hands. asians are genetically smaller and more nimble with their hands. best example of this is the fact that koreans can pick up a single grain of rice with metallic chopsticks no thicker than a twig....
due to this "physical" limitation, training the new workers at the alabama plant has been EXTENSIVE. Hyundai engineers knew of the potential loss in quality--and they've done their best to plug this potential leak.
we'll see how the new sonata is and find out!
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06-26-05, 12:54 AM
#8
Originally Posted by mjr24
Uh okay....whatever that meant "playa".
Hyundais are offered at a good price and the warranties are very good, but I certainly do not think the cars they have offered lately have changed the Hyundai stigma. They have copied about every luxury automaker's style exteriorwise which cheapens it IMHO.
Hyundais are offered at a good price and the warranties are very good, but I certainly do not think the cars they have offered lately have changed the Hyundai stigma. They have copied about every luxury automaker's style exteriorwise which cheapens it IMHO.
on topic:
I sat in one of the new Sonatas that a friend of mine bought... I must say, I am EXTREMELY impressed... even the quality improvement over my sister's 2003 Sante Fe so far as interior and drive/ride/feel is very much improved.
I hope they come out with that cool mid-engined car and I hope the next Tiburon (which is confirmed RWD) will give the 350z a run for its money for 2/3 the price
06-26-05, 02:18 AM
#9
This country is so obsessed with image and status symbols.. doesnt matter how good hyundai gets
it will never be taken seriously by some and thats a shame.. Look at lexus for example.. wins awards year after year and we still have to put up with tons of BS.
it will never be taken seriously by some and thats a shame.. Look at lexus for example.. wins awards year after year and we still have to put up with tons of BS.
06-26-05, 03:05 AM
#10
Originally Posted by Erick G
This country is so obsessed with image and status symbols.. doesnt matter how good hyundai gets
it will never be taken seriously by some and thats a shame.. Look at lexus for example.. wins awards year after year and we still have to put up with tons of BS.
it will never be taken seriously by some and thats a shame.. Look at lexus for example.. wins awards year after year and we still have to put up with tons of BS.
06-26-05, 09:00 AM
#12
Super Moderator
Originally Posted by LT. LEX
I've heard rumors of Hyundai producing a luxury line with some possible RWD V-8 action. Can anyone confirm or deny this rumor?
06-26-05, 09:09 AM
#13
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by glennp1999
Enough said! It's going to take more than publishing from consumer mags or JD power to convince many people that this car is ligit.
The question is.....and the main topic of this thread.....with the new AL plant, will it KEEP happening...at least for the Sonata? No one can predict that right now...only time will tell.
06-26-05, 12:32 PM
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He's calling you a TOOLBOX in a very friendly manner because of the totally useless post you made previously.
If a manufacturer is really on the up and up, should it really matter where the car is being built? I do not disagree that some of the things you guys mentioned with the Americans' hands being bigger, the amount of work, etc. are factors, but should they be? Hyundais and Kias still have this bad rep. because their cars are still very cheap pricewise when everything else has gone up.