View Poll Results: where is Lexus compared to other brands?
Already the same level as Benz, BMW
37
27.01%
Already surpassed those European luxury brands
30
21.90%
Higher than Acura and Infiniti, but still lower than M-B and BMW
69
50.36%
Not much different from Toyota
1
0.73%
Voters: 137. You may not vote on this poll
Lexus' brand image
04-18-05, 05:46 PM
#31
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Why are these AMG/M cars such a big deal? They're clearly not THAT important, because I'm sure most people here perceive Lexus's prestige as higher than that of Audi's, yet Audi makes S/RS cars.
04-18-05, 05:54 PM
#32
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by Incendiary
Why are these AMG/M cars such a big deal? They're clearly not THAT important, because I'm sure most people here perceive Lexus's prestige as higher than that of Audi's, yet Audi makes S/RS cars.
But I think the point of gsWarrior's post is that having an AMG/M type of division in the lineup is one of the prerequisites to achieving that level of image, and probably the only prerequisite left for Lexus to meet.
Last edited by XeroK00L; 04-18-05 at 05:59 PM.
04-18-05, 06:43 PM
#33
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Originally Posted by XeroK00L
Yes, and that's why I said the best objective indicator would be the fact that MB and BMW are able to charge people more than Lexus for similarly equipped vehicles while still maintaining comparable unit sales (meaning that people are still willing to pay more for MB/BMW's level of image).
But I think the point of gsWarrior's post is that having an AMG/M type of division in the lineup is one of the prerequisites to achieving that level of image, and probably the only prerequisite left for Lexus to meet.
But I think the point of gsWarrior's post is that having an AMG/M type of division in the lineup is one of the prerequisites to achieving that level of image, and probably the only prerequisite left for Lexus to meet.
Last edited by Incendiary; 04-18-05 at 07:25 PM. Reason: typo
04-18-05, 07:21 PM
#34
Originally Posted by gsWarrior
if lexus can make a car able to compete with AMGs and M, then they will be perceived as equal. until then, i'd have to agree that lexus is still a notch below BMW and MB.
04-19-05, 08:52 AM
#35
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There is no doubt Lexus builds the BEST car and the BEST car for the money but overall, I see Lexus as being in the same level as BMW and Benz but under those 2. So Tier 1 is
1. Benz
2. BMW
3. Lexus
Lexus simply does not offer the vast array of V-12 cars, Turbos, superchargers. They only have 1 coupe, the SC, the competition has more than one. With BMW and Benz, you can build the cars almost how you want (once you have the dough). You also do have the prestige which may sound silly but CLEARLY, it counts and people will pay for it.
Tier 2 I guess would be almost everyone else. There is NO MORE room for another Tier 1 brand. The market is already saturated as it is. We don't have to state the reasons why those 3 are on top, its clearly obvious.
And honestly, sad as it seems, if you want to know where BRAND IMAGE is, look at Hollywood or watch/listen to the hip-hop game. They may not KNOW anything about cars, and that is the point, the IMAGE is what drove the purchase. And clearly, the top 3 brands are BMW, Benz, Lexus and you absolutely have to give kudos to one SUV, the Escalade.
1. Benz
2. BMW
3. Lexus
Lexus simply does not offer the vast array of V-12 cars, Turbos, superchargers. They only have 1 coupe, the SC, the competition has more than one. With BMW and Benz, you can build the cars almost how you want (once you have the dough). You also do have the prestige which may sound silly but CLEARLY, it counts and people will pay for it.
Tier 2 I guess would be almost everyone else. There is NO MORE room for another Tier 1 brand. The market is already saturated as it is. We don't have to state the reasons why those 3 are on top, its clearly obvious.
And honestly, sad as it seems, if you want to know where BRAND IMAGE is, look at Hollywood or watch/listen to the hip-hop game. They may not KNOW anything about cars, and that is the point, the IMAGE is what drove the purchase. And clearly, the top 3 brands are BMW, Benz, Lexus and you absolutely have to give kudos to one SUV, the Escalade.
04-19-05, 09:18 AM
#36
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Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
There is no doubt Lexus builds the BEST car and the BEST car for the money but overall, I see Lexus as being in the same level as BMW and Benz but under those 2. So Tier 1 is
1. Benz
2. BMW
3. Lexus
Lexus simply does not offer the vast array of V-12 cars, Turbos, superchargers. They only have 1 coupe, the SC, the competition has more than one. With BMW and Benz, you can build the cars almost how you want (once you have the dough). You also do have the prestige which may sound silly but CLEARLY, it counts and people will pay for it.
Tier 2 I guess would be almost everyone else. There is NO MORE room for another Tier 1 brand. The market is already saturated as it is. We don't have to state the reasons why those 3 are on top, its clearly obvious.
And honestly, sad as it seems, if you want to know where BRAND IMAGE is, look at Hollywood or watch/listen to the hip-hop game. They may not KNOW anything about cars, and that is the point, the IMAGE is what drove the purchase. And clearly, the top 3 brands are BMW, Benz, Lexus and you absolutely have to give kudos to one SUV, the Escalade.
1. Benz
2. BMW
3. Lexus
Lexus simply does not offer the vast array of V-12 cars, Turbos, superchargers. They only have 1 coupe, the SC, the competition has more than one. With BMW and Benz, you can build the cars almost how you want (once you have the dough). You also do have the prestige which may sound silly but CLEARLY, it counts and people will pay for it.
Tier 2 I guess would be almost everyone else. There is NO MORE room for another Tier 1 brand. The market is already saturated as it is. We don't have to state the reasons why those 3 are on top, its clearly obvious.
And honestly, sad as it seems, if you want to know where BRAND IMAGE is, look at Hollywood or watch/listen to the hip-hop game. They may not KNOW anything about cars, and that is the point, the IMAGE is what drove the purchase. And clearly, the top 3 brands are BMW, Benz, Lexus and you absolutely have to give kudos to one SUV, the Escalade.
Lexus will up its prestige by getting more celebs and company officials to buy their cars and by becoming less of a "value" brand compared to MB and BMW. AMG/M competitors and adding tons of new coupes and convertibles will help increase visibility to an extent before the brand begins to get diluted.
04-19-05, 09:33 AM
#37
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Originally Posted by Incendiary
Just as I don't think AMG/M cars make prestige (to wit, look at Audi), I don't think having a huge range of cars increases prestige either (to wit, look at BMW in the late 90's - 3, 5, 7 and either Z3 or 8).
Lexus will up its prestige by getting more celebs and company officials to buy their cars and by becoming less of a "value" brand compared to MB and BMW. AMG/M competitors and adding tons of new coupes and convertibles will help increase visibility to an extent before the brand begins to get diluted.
Lexus will up its prestige by getting more celebs and company officials to buy their cars and by becoming less of a "value" brand compared to MB and BMW. AMG/M competitors and adding tons of new coupes and convertibles will help increase visibility to an extent before the brand begins to get diluted.
And I am not disagreeing with you, just commenting.
04-19-05, 11:48 AM
#38
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Originally Posted by Incendiary
Just as I don't think AMG/M cars make prestige (to wit, look at Audi), I don't think having a huge range of cars increases prestige either (to wit, look at BMW in the late 90's - 3, 5, 7 and either Z3 or 8).
Lexus will up its prestige by getting more celebs and company officials to buy their cars and by becoming less of a "value" brand compared to MB and BMW. AMG/M competitors and adding tons of new coupes and convertibles will help increase visibility to an extent before the brand begins to get diluted.
Lexus will up its prestige by getting more celebs and company officials to buy their cars and by becoming less of a "value" brand compared to MB and BMW. AMG/M competitors and adding tons of new coupes and convertibles will help increase visibility to an extent before the brand begins to get diluted.
I dont think that the amg/m cars on their own make prestige but i do think they play a bigger factor than u believe. I see your point with Audi and their performance line up not equating to prestige but i just feel that for Lexus to truly be on equal ground, they're going to have something that can compare with the Ms or AMGs straight from the factory.
04-30-05, 05:05 PM
#39
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no heritage
The old Mercedes gull wings have style, the BMW's have the racing heritage and the M series.... Lexus is working on the style, but they have no performace line to complete with the M
04-30-05, 05:21 PM
#40
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by gsWarrior
BMW and MB have that extra gear which they can shift into, that extra oomph in their M and AMG lineups.
I .
I .
05-01-05, 09:54 AM
#41
Lexus Test Driver
even though bmw and mb dont sell that many of the m or amg models, at least they offer it. i think when people think lexus, reliability and luxury comes to mind, but not status like mb and bmw..............
05-01-05, 07:31 PM
#42
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on a strict prestige level i think its a mistake to leave out a jag, especially the xk & xj. thede autos have a panache which only an sl ,cls or s class can equal. actually porsche still is tops for theprestige factor
05-01-05, 10:07 PM
#43
Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
There is no doubt Lexus builds the BEST car and the BEST car for the money but overall, I see Lexus as being in the same level as BMW and Benz but under those 2. So Tier 1 is
1. Benz
2. BMW
3. Lexus
Lexus simply does not offer the vast array of V-12 cars, Turbos, superchargers. They only have 1 coupe, the SC, the competition has more than one. With BMW and Benz, you can build the cars almost how you want (once you have the dough). You also do have the prestige which may sound silly but CLEARLY, it counts and people will pay for it.
Tier 2 I guess would be almost everyone else. There is NO MORE room for another Tier 1 brand. The market is already saturated as it is. We don't have to state the reasons why those 3 are on top, its clearly obvious.
And honestly, sad as it seems, if you want to know where BRAND IMAGE is, look at Hollywood or watch/listen to the hip-hop game. They may not KNOW anything about cars, and that is the point, the IMAGE is what drove the purchase. And clearly, the top 3 brands are BMW, Benz, Lexus and you absolutely have to give kudos to one SUV, the Escalade.
1. Benz
2. BMW
3. Lexus
Lexus simply does not offer the vast array of V-12 cars, Turbos, superchargers. They only have 1 coupe, the SC, the competition has more than one. With BMW and Benz, you can build the cars almost how you want (once you have the dough). You also do have the prestige which may sound silly but CLEARLY, it counts and people will pay for it.
Tier 2 I guess would be almost everyone else. There is NO MORE room for another Tier 1 brand. The market is already saturated as it is. We don't have to state the reasons why those 3 are on top, its clearly obvious.
And honestly, sad as it seems, if you want to know where BRAND IMAGE is, look at Hollywood or watch/listen to the hip-hop game. They may not KNOW anything about cars, and that is the point, the IMAGE is what drove the purchase. And clearly, the top 3 brands are BMW, Benz, Lexus and you absolutely have to give kudos to one SUV, the Escalade.
Exactly, and I read on this board that the top mentions in rap music, by mentions are 1. Benz, and 2. Lexus
As far as the Tier 1 thing goes, I completely agree, 3 is max, although its possible that one may drop out and a lesser company take its place, I don't think that is likely or could happen outside 10 years. More likely however, the idea of movement within the Tier 1. I'd like to see Lexus ascend to #1 of Tier 1. As far as reliability, quality, interior design, and overall refinement I think Lexus is already #1 of Tier 1. As for prestige, that needs to be accrued over time...
Lexus will up its prestige by getting more celebs and company officials to buy their cars and by becoming less of a "value" brand compared to MB and BMW. AMG/M competitors and adding tons of new coupes and convertibles will help increase visibility to an extent before the brand begins to get diluted.
05-02-05, 12:21 AM
#44
Lexus Champion
Originally Posted by b1gredek
even though bmw and mb dont sell that many of the m or amg models, at least they offer it.
SL65, S65....all spoken for 6 months in advance...
and the reason why there aren't more on the road is because they're limited production...
they're only making a few thousand S65's, etc...
05-02-05, 06:23 PM
#45
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So what Lexus doesn't have anything to compete against AMGs and Ms? There is nothing perfect, if you want your car to be extremely comfortable, then you have to sacrifice some fun handling. BMW can not match Lexus's quietness, why don't people mention it then?