http://carreviewsonline.auto123.com/en/info/autonews/index,view.spy?cmd=view&artid=34638&pg=1

A nice read. We've already covered though. :)

Thanks for the link.

A very basic comparison done without touching either car. But, it seems no one has been able to touch the GS as of yet.

But the real story behind both sedans isn't the refined power available under their hoods, but rather just how much more competitive each is to their main rivals, the BMW 5-Series and Mercedes-Benz S-Class [emphasis mine].

Obviously a typo or a sign of a not-so-qualified automotive journalist.

Thanks for the link.

A very basic comparison done without touching either car. But, it seems no one has been able to touch the GS as of yet.

But the real story behind both sedans isn't the refined power available under their hoods, but rather just how much more competitive each is to their main rivals, the BMW 5-Series and Mercedes-Benz S-Class [emphasis mine].

Obviously a typo or a sign of a not-so-qualified automotive journalist.
Yeah, I saw that too! Good catch.

Another mistake:

Infiniti's more recent M is not to be confused with the front-drive M30 coupe and convertible that came on the scene during Infiniti's debut at the 1989 Greater Los Angeles Auto Show, yes, where Lexus also introduced its LS 400 and ES 250.

The M30 wasn't FWD. The M30 was RWD, and based on the JDM Nissan Leopard.

Another mistake:



The M30 wasn't FWD. The M30 was RWD, and based on the JDM Nissan Leopard.
You should get a trophy b/c I don't think anyone knew the M30 even existed, let alone any facts about it. Good show! :thumbup:

Another mistake:



The M30 wasn't FWD. The M30 was RWD, and based on the JDM Nissan Leopard.

M30? What's that? hehe. jk. The M30 was a flop, along with the G20, J30 and the I30.

The g20 was not sold as much as they anticipated but it was also not a flop.

Another error: the older M45 was not based on the Q (as our hero states in his review) but was essentially the older Nissan Cedric with a V8. Big on the outside, small on the inside, unloved by many.

Glad to see someone else remembers the old Leopard based M30; there are still a couple floating around this area. And the G20 wasn't a flop but it really was probably a mistake for Infiniti. I don't think a luxury brand really wants to establish a foothold down in the econocar segment (and obviously, neither do they since there are no more 4 cylinder Sentras......I mean, G whatevers).

Credit where credit is due: no more of that sort of nonsense since Ghosn hit the scene.

March Motortrend Comparo.

1) M35 (Non-sport)
2) RL
3) 530i sport
4) STS V6
5) A6
6) S-type

M35 stats:
0-60: 6.3
60-0: 118 ft
1/4 mile: 14.7@92
slalom: 64.4
skidpad: .86g

I guess the GS300 was not available for testing. Dunno why the E320 was not included.

An upcoming sport sedan comparo should be intresting in the major auto mags that's for sure! :cool:

March Motortrend Comparo.

1) M35 (Non-sport)
2) RL
3) 530i sport
4) STS V6
5) A6
6) S-type

M35 stats:
0-60: 6.3
60-0: 118 ft
1/4 mile: 14.7@92
slalom: 64.4
skidpad: .86g

I guess the GS300 was not available for testing. Dunno why the E320 was not included.

MB didn't want to provide an out going model (E350 right around the corner)- actually I'm surprised BMW didn't hold off and provide the MY06 model coming in a couple of months.
I guess the sport setup on the M makes a diff - the skidpad numbers on it were .91. The M will win the performance numbers in all of these test - although the 7Gmatic E350 might be close (6.9s 0-100kph from MB) - it should be close - it's only down 8 HP from the M (272 vs 280), but it's lighter and has one extra cog.

I will wait & reserve judgement untill a fair test can be conducted on the GS 300 & 430. Those numbers onre only a small slice of an overall evaluation of a vehicle. Let's say the GS 300 goes from 0 -60 in 6.5 seconds (for the sake of arguement) & like you stated, the M35 does it in 6.3......what that is telling me is if I'm driving on a 350 mile trip......I will get there .2 seconds quicker in the M35 over the GS 300 :rolleyes: which is a bummer because that means if I choose the GS 300......I get to enjoy the car .2 seconds more then lol ;) :rolleyes: It dosen't mean anything really! :nono:

I will wait & reserve judgement untill a fair test can be conducted on the GS 300 & 430. Those numbers onre only a small slice of an overall evaluation of a vehicle. Let's say the GS 300 goes from 0 -60 in 6.5 seconds (for the sake of arguement) & like you stated, the M35 does it in 6.3......what that is telling me is if I'm driving on a 350 mile trip......I will get there .2 seconds quicker in the M35 over the GS 300 :rolleyes: which is a bummer because that means if I choose the GS 300......I get to enjoy the car .2 seconds more then lol ;) :rolleyes: It dosen't mean anything really! :nono:
Very true for informed educated consumers, but todays' marketeers want to have big HP and low 0-60 times to brag about.

Very true for informed educated consumers, but todays' marketeers want to have big HP and low 0-60 times to brag about.

Agreed! However the vast majority of Lexus customers are well educated with their vehicles.....& understand this point. That's why it dosen't bother them much as they know that chances are......they will be able to install factory performance options (L-tuned parts) under warranty for a boost in performance. :thumbup: More than performance, Lexus owners car about things like reliability, build quality, styling & luxury appointments......with performance lower on the list.......major auto magazines are the ones for the most part that put irrelevent performance numbers at the top of their list when evaluation vehicles. :cool: Lexus may not be at the top of the list in performance, but they are always in 'the thick of things'. :bigok:

Agreed! However the vast majority of Lexus customers are well educated with their vehicles.....& understand this point. That's why it dosen't bother them much as they know that chances are......they will be able to install factory performance options (L-tuned parts) under warranty for a boost in performance. :thumbup:
The only problem I see - as good as the Lexus name has gotten, even an L-tuned badge is not as good as having AMG on the rear deck lid. :cool:

The only problem I see - as good as the Lexus name has gotten, even an L-tuned badge is not as good as having AMG on the rear deck lid. :cool:

Fair enough.....let's not forget how old Lexus is compared to Mercedes Benz. If the 2 companies were the same age, including their 'performance arms' of the companies, that would be a whole different story. Performance aside, with Lexus still a fairly young company all things considered, they embarrass the Germans in the reliability department......global surveys back that up.....& if I were Audi, MB or BMW........that would bug me MUCH more than if I could beat a Lexus 0 - 60 by half a second. Plus the get Lexus for thousands (if not tens of thousands less & hold re-sale value better to boot! ;) :bigthumbu

The only problem I see - as good as the Lexus name has gotten, even an L-tuned badge is not as good as having AMG on the rear deck lid. :cool:

That was the past. Toyota & Lexus live on the philosphy of constant improvement. L-Tuned no longer exists, and was a product of TRD USA...which is slowly starting to shrink. TRD Japan on the other hand, that's a whole different story. It's all inside politics. The GT line of cars Lexus is planning to unveil is something to look forward to. We will have to wait and see what Lexus has in store for the near future.

March Motortrend Comparo.

1) M35 (Non-sport)
2) RL
3) 530i sport
4) STS V6
5) A6
6) S-type

M35 stats:
0-60: 6.3
60-0: 118 ft
1/4 mile: 14.7@92
slalom: 64.4
skidpad: .86g

I guess the GS300 was not available for testing. Dunno why the E320 was not included.

Wow, nice showing for the M35 non-sport. Those places seem about right, but I am surprised that the A6 came in 5th. The M35 got some awesome numbers!

Wow, nice showing for the M35 non-sport. Those places seem about right, but I am surprised that the A6 came in 5th. The M35 got some awesome numbers!

Let's see how the M does overall against the GS 300 (both RWD & AWD). :cool: :thumbup:

I will wait & reserve judgement untill a fair test can be conducted on the GS 300 & 430. Those numbers onre only a small slice of an overall evaluation of a vehicle. Let's say the GS 300 goes from 0 -60 in 6.5 seconds (for the sake of arguement) & like you stated, the M35 does it in 6.3......what that is telling me is if I'm driving on a 350 mile trip......I will get there .2 seconds quicker in the M35 over the GS 300 :rolleyes: which is a bummer because that means if I choose the GS 300......I get to enjoy the car .2 seconds more then lol ;) :rolleyes: It dosen't mean anything really! :nono:
lmao.....yup, in 5 years, the leather is worn, the paint is all chipped up and the dealer doesn't have loaners etc etc.....

There is much more to a luxury car than childish 0-60 games.

Excerpts from the MT comparo is trickling in:

".... several staffers preferred the RL's blend of luxury and performance, but others felt it lacks the visceral immediacy and tactile feedback to the steering, throttle, and brakes that are hallmarks of a true driver’s car. Second place but barely. You'll find those qualities, and more, in the first place finisher, the Infiniti M35. Though not as powerful as the Acura RL, the M35 proved the quickest, thanks to lower weight and closer ratio gearing. The Infiniti's front-midship layout provides near-perfect weight balance, and the chassis communicates texture and grain that makes the driving experience all the richer. Of course, the Infinity's cabin is hushed and exquisitely trimmed in rich leather , real wood, and techno toys , but look, traffic just cleared. Time to put down the joystick and grip that steering wheel. When the road is yours, and yours alone you'll want to be behind the wheel of the Infiniti M35."

"... like all BMW sedans over the last three decades , the 530i leaves no doubt that it is a drivers car. It has great poise, finely balanced weight distribution, and a turbine smooth in line six, and it tied for first place in Motor trend's figure eight test. So why isn't the 530i the overall winner? We found the middle BMW polarizing, some editors enjoying its harder edges but many flummoxed by the unpredictability of its Active Steering, confused by obtuse iDrive functions, and repelled by its "flame-buoyant" styling. All agreed that the third place 530i offers the least value for the money"

0-60 times

RL 6.7
Audi 7.3
BMW 6.8 (manual)
Cadillac 6.8
M35 6.3
Jaguar 7.8

Apparently, this was the only negative comment about the M:

"....some editors had issues with the layout of the secondary controls for the climate and audio systems on the center stack, particulary the ones atop the dash."

Some other comments on the M:

".... superb weight balance and pinpoint steering make this sport sedan a willing partner on any road you care to choose. No wonder the M35 smoked the competition in acceleration test and tied for first with the sport package equipped 530i in braking and the figure eight test."


I guess Lexus is putting the finishing touches on the GS300; otherwise, they'd have provided MT with one.

The GS300 will get trounced in 0-60 (probably high 6's) & quarter-mile by the M35. Now if it's the GS350 that'll be available elsewhere . . .

It will be interesting to see a detailed test of the GS and what difference, if any, the various suspension settings have on performance. I would think that a dedicated Sport model like the 530 or M35 would be better than some Sport setting on a switch - but we'll see how swift those Toyota engineers were.

If the GS can manage anything under 7s 0-60, it will be in the ballpark where the other few tenths won't matter much.

The amazing thing about the M35 is not the 0-60 time, it's the fact that it can equal the 530 in slalom and braking with a 300lb penalty. With figures like that, who needs the Sport model. I wonder what the rear steering of the Sport model adds to the performance equation. :cool:

If you want to use something as reference, the latest generation Solara can pull a 0-60 time of 6.8 with only a 225hp 3.3L 3MZ-FE V6 and a 5spd auto. That's a very heavy front drive car based off the Camry. The old 0-60 times for the previous generation automatic Camry Solara w/3.0L 1MZ-FE and 200hp, 4spd auto was 7.8-8.0 seconds fast for it's time. I have faith in Toyota that the new 6spd auto tranny will generate lower if not a few tenths better than their predecessors for the 6 and 8 cylinder.

Sorry if this question was asked and answered, but Flip(or anyone else) do you know why the 350 isnt available in the US but available in Japan??

Sorry if this question was asked and answered, but Flip(or anyone else) do you know why the 350 isnt available in the US but available in Japan??

That's a question I wish I could answer. It's all within US Lexus marketing there in Torrance that decided why we only get the GS300 unfortunately. If I had to take a stab at a guess, they will be giving us 3 different engine choices for the GS, they wanted to diversify the line up with different engines for the American market. Even though the new IS is getting the 2.5 and 3.5, it still doesn't make sense to me why Lexus USA would get the lesser choice? I guess the logic lies behind target demographics. In Japan, the Aristo was given 2 engine choices, the 2JZ-GE VVT-i N/A and the 2JZ-GTE VVT-i where as here in North America, we got the 2JZ-GE and the 1UZ-FE later the 3UZ-FE v8's. :uh:

Sorry if this question was asked and answered, but Flip(or anyone else) do you know why the 350 isnt available in the US but available in Japan??
So getting the GS350 next year will be a big deal.

Maybe Lexus sees a downturn in the market (I always wonder if this segment has a finite sales limit - are sales coming from new customers or from other brands) and offering the GS350 next year will look like a briliant marketing move, when the competition has already thrown everything in their offerings from the begining and have nothing extra to offer.

Sure, for a little while everyone of the new models can command MSRP and sell everything the assembly line can churn out. What happens next year when the first year hoopla dies down? WIth the exception of the E class, what you see this year will probably stay the same for at least 3 MYs, and most won't change drastically for 5MYs.
Is there a steady stream of 2K/mo customers for all the brands (the E class and 5 series are a bit above that but most makers in this category will be selling around that figure)? The only ones that sold that were E class and 5 series. Now RL, A6, STS, GS and M all will sell that also. So when all the must-have-it-first folks have their cars who's going to be able to keep up the 2K/mo sales? Maybe Lexus is thinking ahead and cars like the GS350 and GS450H will keep up their sales - at the expense of the others.

are sales coming from new customers or from other brands

You probably mean are sales coming from repeat buyers or from other brands. It's only obvious people from other brands will be new customers. :slap:

There is a percentage of sales to Lexus who are repeat customers. Alot of Lexus sales is done in part by new customers. Which is why they are the #1 selling luxury nameplate in the United States in the last few years. Toyota and Lexus top the charts when it comes to repeat buyers and brand loyalty. Something the other car manufacturers can only wish for at this point.

You probably mean are sales coming from repeat buyers or from other brands. It's only obvious people from other brands will be new customers. :slap:

When I meant new customers, I meant new to the 45K luxury sedan segment in general. If the segment were a zero sum game, all of the increased sales for GS, RL, and M would have to come from MB and BMW and A6. The total sales currently is around 10-12K/mo (7-8K of which is MB and BMW) depending on how many brands one includes. The first few months each new model will have its peaks, but when all are for sale will the total really go up to 18-20K/mo and stay there? Where are these buyers now? Some other segment's gotta be the loser with all of these projected increased sales.

I suspect that Lexus 'eventually' (I won't specify a time frame) you will see at least the AWD model with the 3.5L. ;) :cool: :thumbup: We shall see what owners say about things in general after the car has been out for the first year. :cool:

I suspect that Lexus 'eventually' (I won't specify a time frame) you will see at least the AWD model with the 3.5L. ;) :cool: :thumbup: We shall see what owners say about things in general after the car has been out for the first year. :cool:
It seems pretty obvious when the 07 comes out it will be a GS350 and AWD will be available.

So getting the GS350 next year will be a big deal.

Maybe Lexus sees a downturn in the market (I always wonder if this segment has a finite sales limit - are sales coming from new customers or from other brands) and offering the GS350 next year will look like a briliant marketing move, when the competition has already thrown everything in their offerings from the begining and have nothing extra to offer.

Sure, for a little while everyone of the new models can command MSRP and sell everything the assembly line can churn out. What happens next year when the first year hoopla dies down? WIth the exception of the E class, what you see this year will probably stay the same for at least 3 MYs, and most won't change drastically for 5MYs.
Is there a steady stream of 2K/mo customers for all the brands (the E class and 5 series are a bit above that but most makers in this category will be selling around that figure)? The only ones that sold that were E class and 5 series. Now RL, A6, STS, GS and M all will sell that also. So when all the must-have-it-first folks have their cars who's going to be able to keep up the 2K/mo sales? Maybe Lexus is thinking ahead and cars like the GS350 and GS450H will keep up their sales - at the expense of the others.

The GS350 won't create much of a hoopla since most of the competition will already be at 3.5 and the Lexus will merely be matching. Hybrids, on the other hand, are a different story.

Well this is what I am thinking.
GS 300 entry-level. 240hp. Important b/c it will be very fuel efficient, and pretty quick (not class leading), better than the current GS 300. Funny but most people in this segment are not worried about high hp. That is not what makes this segment.
GS450h mid level-300hp, 3.5 liter engine with hybrid power
GS 460-350hp

What will happen is what happened in 2001. When the next LS comes out, probably with a new 4.6 liter engine, the GS will also inherit this engine, thus GS 430 becomes GS 460, like how the GS 400 became GS 430 when the GS inherited the bigger motor.

There is no way the LS will remain a 430 when the next model debuts as a LS worlwide in 2006.

This will also keep the product cycle fresh, like it did in 2001. :)

It seems pretty obvious when the 07 comes out it will be a GS350 and AWD will be available.

How are you sure on that? Toyota/Lexus generally releases a new powertrain in 3rd year of production. I don't think Lexus will release the GS450h and a GS350 in the states at the same time. They have never done such a thing and it wouldn't make sense. It would be like releasing the new IS250/350 at the same time in March with the new GS...which is exactly what they are not doing.

How are you sure on that? Toyota/Lexus generally releases a new powertrain in 3rd year of production. I don't think Lexus will release the GS450h and a GS350 in the states at the same time. They have never done such a thing and it wouldn't make sense. It would be like releasing the new IS250/350 at the same time in March with the new GS...which is exactly what they are not doing.
It all depends on sales. Sure if the GS300 sells good enough, there's no need for the GS350 - but at the first hint of trouble, Lexus could switch to the GS350 which will be selling everywhere outside of NA. I don't think the 450H timing has anything to do with any model - it's kind of out there on its own; like the RX400H frenzy has shown - the hybrid mystique can be sold at any time - even if it's not ready/available.

How are you sure on that? Toyota/Lexus generally releases a new powertrain in 3rd year of production. I don't think Lexus will release the GS450h and a GS350 in the states at the same time. They have never done such a thing and it wouldn't make sense. It would be like releasing the new IS250/350 at the same time in March with the new GS...which is exactly what they are not doing.

I hear what your saying flip.......however, I think that will be one of the biggest complaints from owners of the 3 gen GS & might force Lexus to do things sooner rather than later.....especially with the AWD model. Just my 2 cents. ;)

I hear what your saying flip.......however, I think that will be one of the biggest complaints from owners of the 3 gen GS & might force Lexus to do things sooner rather than later.....especially with the AWD model. Just my 2 cents. ;)

The small portion of complaints from enthusiasts are too little to justify for Lexus to switch powertrains for a certain market. Look at the big picture and the target demographic for the GS3. People have complained that the Gen2 GS300 lacked power, but it still sold regardless for 7 years. Just think about it.

People have complained that the Gen2 GS300 lacked power, but it still sold regardless for 7 years.
Sure, at a pathetic 500/mo at the end, when MB was selling 4K/mo E320s without doing anything. As Infiniti has found out, one way to lure badge chasers is to wow then with HP (and a pretty good car overall). While Lexus does great in the overal sales volume, when it comes to the entry level and mid sized sedan segment it is way behind the leaders.
Look at the RL, take away the 300HP/SHAWD and leave everything else and the marketing guys would have nothing to brag about.
Other than reliability/dealer service what else can a dealer say about the GS to lure some customer away from the others? Class leading gas milage?

Sure, at a pathetic 500/mo at the end, when MB was selling 4K/mo E320s without doing anything. As Infiniti has found out, one way to lure badge chasers is to wow then with HP (and a pretty good car overall). While Lexus does great in the overal sales volume, when it comes to the entry level and mid sized sedan segment it is way behind the leaders.
Look at the RL, take away the 300HP/SHAWD and leave everything else and the marketing guys would have nothing to brag about.
Other than reliability/dealer service what else can a dealer say about the GS to lure some customer away from the others? Class leading gas milage?

Well what we are discussing has all be 'speculation' at this point....let's be patient & see what happens in the first year of the GS & perhaps we will be able to answer your question(s) better at that time biker! ;) I see your point about the previous 2 generations however. :cool:

Sure, at a pathetic 500/mo at the end, when MB was selling 4K/mo E320s without doing anything. ?
Yes, & the previous generation E class & 5 series were able to maintain that kind of sales volume into their final year of production - that's the real sign of success.

While Lexus does great in the overal sales volume, when it comes to the entry level and mid sized sedan segment it is way behind the leaders.

That's not entirely accurate. The current ES is the best selling sedan model in the entry level luxury segment (as well as in all luxury models) in America for the last 2 years, until overtaken by the new Acura TL this year, but still maintaining 6-7K/month in sales.

Other than reliability/dealer service what else can a dealer say about the GS to lure some customer away from the others? Class leading gas milage?

The overall package and value for the consumer is what makes the new GS appealing. The target demographic of the new GS appeals to a broad range, not the 5% that only cares about monster horsepower. Just give it some time, the new GS hasn't been out yet or long enough to show sales figures or how it will stack up against the competition. How about looking at this outside of the box intsead of the narrow close minded views you like to always argue with? You perceive yourself as not even in the market to buy this particular vehicle. So why be devil's advocate if you're looking for that perfect Geo Metro? :cool:

This review has some good interior shots of the M.

http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/pw/06infiniti_m.htm

Impressions of the interior:

"In fact, both "M" models continually surprise with their fine rendering of small components throughout the car. For example, the stitching on the seats, the aluminum gearshift base, the furniture-like wood surfaces and the carefully constructed knobs and buttons are among many interior and exterior components that receive an uncommonly high level of attention. The overall impression is one of quality, refinement and performance potential."

"Also available is a superb Studio Surround Sound Bose DVD audio system with digital 5.1-channel decoding and 14 speakers including two personal speakers mounted in the shoulders of each front seat. This system offers such an exceptional listening experience that it will be the subject of a future article."

This is like the 5th time that a review has highly praised the sound system. I'm definitely curious.

jrock -- thanks for passing that along.

I think that it's the enthusiast side of our minds that is hoping for the GS350 and GS460 next year, but once you sit back and look at the next three years at Lexus and consider how they typically plan things out, and it makes more sense to me that we will see the new engines at the first refresh like flipside is saying. That's unfortunate, but Lexus is completely revamping their non-suv lineup in the next two years and needs to strategically plan introductions as well as refreshes.

First, regardless of engines, the new GS is going to sell like hot cakes for the first six months. By that time, the new IS is going to come out (september) and will continue to attract a rush of consumers for another six months or so. By that time we should see a new SC (according to lexus.jp), and then a new LS and six months or so later, a new ES.

March 2005: New GS launches
April: RX 400h launches
September 2005: New IS launches
Early 2006: New SC launches
April 2006: GS 450h launches
Early-Mid 2006: New LS Launches
Later 2006: New ES launches
Mid-Late 2007 as an '08MY: GS refresh with new engines and slight modifications.

Obviously that is just a rough, hypothetical outline of the next two years at Lexus, but they are going to have a steady stream of new products and hopefully a steady stream of customers coming through their showrooms. Also, there will be a refreshed RX330 (350?), new GX and LX, and a new $100,000 vehicle, possibly based off the LF-A in this timeframe.

They won't want to detract attention from their all new products by revamping the GS in late '06 for two reasons. 1) It's going to take attention away from the new ES and LS and 2) The third generation GS is going to need some sort of substantial upgrade, where new engines would be ideal and they need to phase that far out enough to be able to revive interest in the car at some point. If they phase it two and a half years out, it will be after the new LS, IS, ES, and SC have been out and then the GS can once again enjoy the spotlight.

The new engines at launch would be awesome, but realistically and rationally I don't think it's going to happen.

-Michael-

Also, I don't want to be a troll here but without the Sports Package, this car SCREAMS Nissan to me. While the rims on the GS300 aren't spectacular, at least the car itself is attractive. The 5Spoke rims on the GS430 enhance what is already a good looking car. The M looks to me like an upscale Nissan that is beefed up with racey 19" wheels...once you remove those things don't look so great to me anymore. With these 18" wheels the car looks...well...dead.

http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/pw/images/infinitim_8.jpg

I agree -- the M doesn't carry its beauty on the outside. The concept was much more appealing.

When it comes to drive appeal, however, only time will tell.

The new engines at launch would be awesome, but realistically and rationally I don't think it's going to happen.



You're finally learning! I'm proud of you. :bigthumbu

i just read the Infiniiti M35/45 interior designers used a piano for its inspiration.

flip....i posted the new pix from my third visit from the houston auto show...its probably my last visit =( i promised pix of what you all wanted...and i delivered.....enjoy =)

oh by the way...all 10 colors that were in that one thread witht he new GS in different colors....all 10 are coming out....



the M SUX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!

the M SUX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!

I will be seeing the new GS and new M for the first time next Monday. I cannot wait and have been amused and somewhat perplexed by some of the conflicting posts on CL and Nissan's Fresh Alloy.

There are Infiniti people loving the GS and hating the M, and there are Lexus fanatics loving the M and hating the GS. While these cars would never be confused with one another stylistically, I don't see how either car warrants major negative rants related to its exterior styling. I know it is all a matter of personal opinion, but I just don't see how either car could be considered ugly or strangely styled. Then again, I have not seen either in person, so I am VERY anxious to do that next week.

My decision is literally in a dead-heat between the GS and M and in a way I hope I really dislike the styling of one of the 2006's. It would make my decision a lot easier. There are so many other non-exterior styling points I have stored in my head that I need to get them down on paper to make a good decision. Of course, all bets are off if I fall in love with one body over another.

In sum, those of you seeing both these cars in person, keep the opinions coming...You have all informed me, amused me, and confused me in your widely varying opinions. It will be you people I look to in the spring and summer, wondering how the ownership experience of these two cars is treating you.....in EVERY way! Then, when the dust has settled in late summer, I should be driving my new GS....or wait M....oh no GS...I am so confused. :confused: